architectural review board meeting um
kathy can we have the call or that role
call please mr heyer here mr steele here
mrs krosky here chairman scott
here
uh this is our time in the meeting where
there's opportunity for public comment
on
anyone who does not have standings
tonight or
it wants to discuss any topics that are
unrelated to the projects on our agenda
is there anybody in the audience that
has uh comments they want
no all right
we'll move on
of the minutes has the board had a
chance to review the minutes
we have any comments regarding the
minutes
no comments do we have a motion to
approve the minutes so moved
seconded
yes mr steele yes chairman scott yes
on our agenda tonight we have four table
applications uh which will be tabled
until october 13th
those applications are arb 2234
at 348 south cassingham arb 2235 at 2456
sherwood b-zap 20-48
at 2300 east livingston avenue and b-zap
20-52 at 420 north cassidy avenue
those projects will not be in cases will
not be heard tonight
moving on we have
two applications tonight for consent
agenda
application arb 2250
at 219 north drexel
north drexel applicant amy lauerhouse
owner francis moss and eric katz
and arb 2251 at 52 south cassidy
applicant is amy lauerhouse owner becky
and kyle koenig are there any final
comments from the board
um just that the applicants should work
with the design consultant for final
details of eve's
materials
etc otherwise i have no other comments
we have a motion to approve
so so moved second oh second
please call the roll
skrski
yes
mr steele
yes
yes chairman scott
yes
okay uh first application tonight is arb
2247
at 211 south cassingham applicant matt
dellendorf owner jennifer kelly
the applicant is requesting
architectural review and approval and
certificate of appropriateness for a
covered porch edition
hello please be sworn in state your name
please state your name matt dillendorf
do you solemnly swear or affirm the
testimony you're about to give this
evening is the truth yes i do thank you
thank you
um good evening um i want to start off
by saying to a group of architects i
know these drawings are not what you
would typically expect to see
uh as a little back story to this
property
we recently completed a major renovation
of the entire interior of this house
simplified living architects heidi
bollywood was her architect for that
phase of the project i do think it went
through windows change so i think part
of it went through
either a minor major on that
um towards the end of this project the
homeowner came to me and asked if
we would take on building her a deck and
a covered you know basically this
covered roof structure
outside of the kitchen
i said of course we would do it for her
and i was presented with these drawings
reached out to kathy originally and knew
that we were going to have to come
through this process
and
knowing the detail that is lacking in
these i would tell you
the
concept is really more of what we're
looking at here that if this is a brew
approved in some way shape or form
um
the kellys are willing to have heidi go
back and clean up and give us some more
detail in terms of the things that are
lacking on this
um i think the the bigger thing was
you know is this roofs the main thing
for them and i know it's sideways that
that kitchen window is a servery window
that we did when we did the kitchen it's
one of those gas threat windows that
goes straight out and
uh currently there is a
paver patio you know
six feet down from the uh window where
it is and the whole idea is they want to
be able to enjoy the outdoor living on
the rear side of the house
i i can't figure out how to turn it
sorry you're pretty good at this usually
i probably submitted i guess um
you kind of beat me to the staff report
which is perfectly fine because you
you pretty much recapped our entire
conversation
from yesterday and today
um look i work with heidi a lot i work
with matt a lot the intent is
looks absolutely fine but as matt
already told you what i had brought up
to him these are not acceptable level
drawings
so
um because i'm sure that mr heyer loves
the cap of the columns
so and in all seriousness
it's up to you the board either you can
ask you know
the only the applicant can ask to be
table but um he you can either table the
case till next month or just remain it
to me
to look at finished drawings which i'm
comfortable with heidi doing them she's
come before you often
um but these i you know clearly we had a
conversation already yes can i add one
thing absolutely i i think
um
they had a they had a
not a great experience with something to
do with the front porch in this house
years ago i had nothing to do with it
um
and
she didn't want to go to the expense of
having heidi prepare something if it was
just going to come in and be blankly you
know no
um i think the whole thing was was
really
well i think the whole thing really
revolves around is the concept of what
this is
going to be something that is acceptable
and the final design of it certainly can
be worked out final design details
slices there
okay uh do we have comments from the
board
sure want me to start
hello
so um yes the concept of it for me is
fine
um
i think you're going to i know you're
going to hear probably some comments
from other members so i'll let them make
their comments but it will revolve
around columns
um
and probably
you just want to pay attention to
uh like the details of what are you
going to put along the bottom right
yeah what's the skirting going to be
and um you know it's hard to tell i can
tell that
you know you're at 11 feet at one point
but like what is your height you know
under
like the part that's where that window
is
uh to the kitchen so you know just
refine the details and it looks like
you're doing metal is it like a standard
thing
um and i think
let me look at those pictures
i can find them
i don't know what what is the
i i don't have an issue with that i
think it'll be fine um
so concept-wise i think you just need to
refine the details and you i'm
comfortable with you working uh with
karen on that and you just you know pay
attention to materials pay attention to
those details pay attention to the
columns
and really make sure you're the height
you know you have enough height there
for people yeah okay yep
that's the front of the house
yeah
not a good angle that's from the
driveway of the neighbor's house
so in the next photo you go down
is this correct what you're building
over right so in the drawing the crown
of this is looking like it's sloping in
the drawing but here it's flat
so when this sloped roof comes over this
you're going to have this funky triangle
that's just needs to be worked out
um i would just suggest raising it up a
little bit higher and well and i i think
her fear and again she prepared this was
and i would like to she shows it as a
212. i would like to see it as a 312. we
can do standing seam at 212 and it's
fine but
a 312 would be the preferred thing of
getting you know how close can we get to
the window trim on the second floor
window right exactly you want to be at
least eight inches below that at least
so that was one detail the other is
you're going to need some kind of beam
to support all those rafters
and then for the column
the piers i would just use like a crown
molding instead of doing this big box
thing i mean we're seeing a lot of that
now and it's just it looks it doesn't
look good so let's just try to do
something a little more refined
um
[Music]
and other than that the way that these
the shorter roof comes with the longer
roof you know how you're going to create
that juncture i don't think your
standing seam metal roof guy is going to
like just cutting the standing seam to
create that offset is there some kind of
special detail
that's going to create the longer roof
against the shorter
you know well
i will tell you just remarks my
experience of doing this a lot of times
we're starting where that rib is at the
intersecting point between
short roof span longer roof stand right
so you'll have a rib that breaks the two
fine
i don't have any other comments
mr steele
same thing um
columns the beam
i think
you know about either raising the the
pitch of the roof
to address the door and the triangle
tree and then
it's i guess this is just a little thing
it says harness it says southcast yes
we'll have to make sure that the right
people were noticed so
it is south cassingham it is north
castle it's north but no it's north
okay somehow i have south cassingham so
in the notices i need to double check to
make sure that it's not a typo on the
notice or if it was sent to the wrong
addresses
okay so
i will have to figure that out this is
the first time i became aware of this
okay
that's all i have
yeah
you understand the process
okay so the implications if it was
notifications were sent to the neighbors
of the wrong address we just have to
make sure well it could have just been a
typo on the notice
and that the notices were sent to the
right people so we just have to make
sure
but we can do it afterwards what is the
procedure
if they were sent to the wrong address
probably and after this do they have to
come in
after the fact notice
it's not as concerning based on the fact
that this isn't a variance case but
simply aesthetic yeah so and it will be
back before it will be back before us
that's up to you that's what i was going
to ask you next do you want
um the drawings to come back
uh yeah my recommendation would be yes i
mean they're looking for a go ahead on
based on the design which i think
pending mr scott's opinion here um but
then she could go ahead with the
drawings and bring it back for a final
review okay
that's my opinion we can get it right
the second time around yeah
um so yeah conceptually i think it's
it's fine i think it's it's right on um
i actually i don't hate the drawings
they're rotated
uh
why i say that obviously it's it looks
like maybe the homeowner did the drawing
it doesn't matter uh but if that's the
case then it's actually well done
because we know we've seen many
um you know people aren't necessarily
skilled in drafting so
uh but you know the the the roof
elevation of where it's hitting the
existing building is at 11 feet i know
it's 20 feet wide there's a roof slope
that's been marked 212 we just discussed
you're looking maybe doing a 312 if you
can fit it so i appreciate that actually
there's notes and dimensions and and
kind of parameters that are set on this
design that i can evaluate and as we
move forward we can
we can actually vote on that not only
the the aesthetic and the look but the
material and then the scale and the
proportions and and having some of that
quantitative notes so uh if you
proceed and come back
with new drawings you know i would
highly recommend that information is in
those drawings so
because that makes one our review easier
we can understand it better but also
when we approve that then that is put on
record
and those notes and dimensions and
things are that part of that record so
uh i like the germans
i agree with the comments uh there's
some things missing the box columns and
box capitals i think are uh not
appropriate um
i think that there it's missing some
beams and some other details but overall
the scope and the approach to the the
concept of what's happening i think is
is great and would like to see the
revised drawings okay uh i will make one
recommendation of
um
i love that the lights have
little lines for glowing on them i think
that's well done so
it gives the added effect so i think you
don't see that really
you don't it's nice
well then so what would you like to do
i guess i would ask we have this table
until that's small
good read of the room
we need an emotion we have a motion so
moved
second
let's call the roll
mr heyer yes
sister steele yes
sakroski yes javan scott yes
thank you all very much
our next application is arb 22-48 132
south drexel applicant is foster owner
seth hoffman
the applicant is requesting
architectural review and approval and a
certificate of appropriateness for a
front porch expansion and modification
you saw me swear or from the testimony
you're about to give this evening is the
truth i do thank you
okay
no problem i don't have that much to say
i mean it it's kind of a the next step
in a project that pete has led for many
many years on this project you did the
original renovation correct um it'll be
a great front porch i mean i think that
the reason that it's at the board and
not on consent is just some unanswered
questions that probably could have just
been notes on the drawing but
enough board members wanted to just ask
a few questions about it that that's why
we're here but i think it's a beautiful
project
i also had this discussion with pete
ahead of time because we've had this
with way more than just mr foster
the um
the the notes that they fill out the
pages and pages of written notes that
have the details we're going to try to
find a way that that can be condensed
and and it just be required to be on the
drawings because it's just too
it's it's hard all the way around to
have it
verbally and not just on the drawings
even things as simple as stuck with a
match existing that's always in the
verbal thing
sheets
but i don't like downloading 10 pages
for you to sift through and it seems to
make sense to have them on the drawing
well and and as we continue this
discussion about the level of
you know elevations dimensions you know
leaders that call out materials
i think it's important to
create a balance where we recognize that
particularly with a
renovation like or an addition
there are there are relationships with
existing you know datum lines windows
eaves that we can see in the drawing
and so how much is really
you know necessary in order for us to
understand the concept
and say okay this is at this level this
is an existing thing at this level right
whereas you get a porch like a a new
porch where we don't have any other
datum lines to recognize
and we're sitting there struggling going
okay what is the height of the stadium
line what is the height of this new
porch i don't understand the
relationship between the two
because the drawings aren't clear
so i just want to be
i just wanted to mention that because i
think there are
there's a balance to draw where we you
know especially us designers we can
recognize the proportion and
relationship based on the drawing
how much
and this is really a lead-in to your
comments but how much do we really
demand you know for that kind of uh
presentation
because i'm looking at this
design and i can see these these new
you know pylons with the you know
arced
uh uh recesses and i can see its
relationship to the datum under the
second floor windows i can see the
relationship of the porch columns to
you know other things that are happening
is it just a matter of you know striking
elevation lines and showing relative
relationships
just opening it up
we're just talking about this project
but i think
there's like the last part of our agenda
is the bexley design guidelines so
we're going to be introducing the bexley
design guidelines and it's something
that's going to be the process for multi
months but in that uh this discussion is
happening with our own board
uh of of
yes the drawings like i mean one
and i don't want to jump over we're
doing this because i think
let the rest of the board discuss it but
we have seen a lot of your work in this
town drawings are usually exceptional
you know the designs very
very little do we have critique major
critiques or any conflicts because i
think you do great work
the challenges
i'll talk closer too i think the
challenge for us is on all applications
is that document is getting submitted as
a for record right and then we have
there have been instances in town where
designs are submitted approved and then
things are built and there's they're at
a scale they're not you've seen it i'm
sure on other projects
what do we have as a board as a
community they say well we approved it
but it doesn't it's it's more
interpretive if it's not hey that's a
that arch spring lines at nine feet
right we have it's harder for us to kind
of quantitatively and qualitatively kind
of pull off together so
not interested in in having full cds
being submitted like right construction
documents that's not what this board's
about but having a little bit more of
terminology on the drawings things being
pointed to eave heights bridge heights
slopes
window sizes specifically kind of caught
us so we have a document that's a little
bit more
you're looking for design polymer
yeah something that's a little bit more
tangible so
and i think that's something that we're
going to continue to discuss and have
open forums about and and love to get
feedback i think it would be important
to have a lot of us participate
in what we do
no doubt
so doubts but that well that's another
thing that's something about this design
guidelines and there's a lot of history
and things happening and we'll talk
about that later so let's get back
related to years for respect to other
people uh so i will
uh let's move over to mr steele do you
have any comments on this particular
project uh the only ones i was wondering
is how
how are you gonna
deal with water on these two new
features here the two kind of the two
kind of flanking
towers they just got a tapered ridge
line
or a tapered roof line that leads to a
discoverer and gets it down stop
as always go just underground okay
and that'll all be in final drawings and
final drawings that'll all be correct
illustrated and things like that
absolutely we do a roof plan that
actually spots all of our downspouts
okay
okay and that was really
okay
that was really the only thing i was
wondering if you're ripping off the
existing
to put if you're ripping off that
existing to come across all the way
except that corner section and then
putting the new scanning scene roof and
things so okay because they all have
their own
uh all of those individual clients
will have their own way of
getting rid of the water okay
okay
me
um
pete are those accessible
no okay
just i was just curious
yeah
i was i was wondering if you're going to
take one of those windows and cut it
down so you could actually walk out
under there
yeah so it's just really a membrane roof
that'll be out there yeah
um i really don't have any other
comments what's the material for the um
paving on the main level
again
that's
why i like maybe participating further
conversations with how the strongest
gets developed yeah what you guys review
right now
it's concrete
and um
we'll see if this bleach down or not we
don't know that would be nice
considering the colors and the warmth at
all yes
would you like to
as a condition
but there's no fun the fun
pitch
let me see here yeah
we don't know
we're waiting on numbers yeah
um i don't really have any other
comments beautiful
sake
yeah i
i think it's a i think it's wonderful
uh and i'm excited to see it for this
house
and i
other than getting some you know
dimensions on there for heights of
things
i think it's great
kudos
i moved to bexley 20 years ago
and i would drive by this house uh
before its previous renovation and and
literally would turn to my wife and say
i don't know who would ever buy that
house i just did i was just not a fan i
was like just kind of weird
and then the renovation happened and i
didn't know you did it and i it turned
into one of my favorites i was like this
the work that it was done on it was was
really
it was really surprised how well it
turned out and it became one of my
favorite houses on drexel because it was
not only the transformation but just
it was just much more balanced so
good job on the previous one
um
and i think this is very interesting i
think the there's there's this move to
kind of
make front porches more accessible um
and i think the existing front porch
feels like more like a covered sidewalk
to the door
so i i think this design really does
change that and focuses it much more as
an outdoor room
which i think is fantastic so i have no
problems with the overall design
proportions
and scale of the project
and i'm confident it's going to be even
a better improvement to what's there now
so thank you
would you like me to read the findings
that's yeah is there anyone in the
audience that would i forgot to do this
before the board spoke but anybody wants
to speak on this particular project that
has standing
seeing none uh could you please find
read the findings of fact
the findings of acting decision of the
board for application number
arb-22-48 for property located at 132
south drexel the architectural review
board finds that the
proposed front porch expansion and
modifications
are architecturally compatible with the
existing structure and further move to
approve a certificate of appropriateness
as submitted
do you agree with those findings in fact
any final comments
well i i jumped in at the beginning
about you know the the idea of adding
more notes and leaders dimensions are
there any are there any comments
regarding this project that are that
you're
requesting
or was it just comments about that
pertaining to this project
in terms of you know adding notes
leaders
i guess i'm just
wondering why
uh
i can have that and if you purposeful
no that comes with construction yeah
but it was part of the it's part of the
uh re it was part of this review and i
just wondered if if there were any
if there was any comment that goes into
the findings for that or no i think that
the official comment would be that
in the
step in the agenda the government the
government document
is listing the materials and the the
before and after the existing versus
what's being proposed
uh
as we move forward as a board it'll be
my
goal to get some of that information
into the actual drafting drawings
presentations renderings because i think
it's that document that in the end we
look to
uh this would kind of go away even
though it is still officially on the
record so
um i personally would not since that's
not a mandate or a decision that's been
publicly announced these are going to be
those requirements and i wouldn't be uh
hesitant to make any make mr foster come
back because we're making that change
we do have this information in that
government document of the what's there
i think for me i would suggest that we
move forward with that record as that
information
and not make mr foster come back
but that we are
basically making some public
announcements that we're moving towards
that okay to be fair that that's as a
side note those are items that karen
also verifies once we receive the
construction drawings to make sure that
they match what was
indicated in the application right i
think for for the overall the overall
thinking at least on in my approach to
this life
is that i would like to have more of
that in the physical drawing aspect of
the submittals again it's not
construction documents we they're not
even finished design development
drawings i get that but having some roof
slopes and some heights and things are
just gives us a quantitative drawing
that we're voting on and it merits being
at me being mentioned in the minutes for
this yes and that's that's why i was
bringing it up at some point mr hires
for public relations just to fill out
fill out the rest of the picture here we
we did have a discussion about this at
our last board workshop and as a result
i have put together a list of
items that we'd like to make sure on
drawings that will be has to be then
downloaded
or
that's kathy's job
to put them into the application so
there's a checklist for the applicant
that everything's on the drawing and
like i had a conversation with this is
not specific to pete
but i we did have this conversation
today and he and i think your response
was does that mean i'd have to fill out
all the paperwork stuff and i might mine
would be like
i don't i think there's no reason to be
redundant i mean at all as long as it's
there yeah
and i think it's also to be fair and not
to be overreaching right it's not that
we're looking for every single thing i
think that would there are cities in
town or in within that that i've worked
with that it gets over
overreaching and that's not a goal i
think it's just having something that we
can point to
when things are constructed that we can
say look this is not what was approved
in saying that are any more open
comments
do we have a motion to approve so moved
second seconded please call the roll
mr steele yes
mr heyer yes scratsky yes chairman scott
yes
thank you for listening
i agree with you
seconds of thoughts
i think
it is interesting that when we fill out
the application that we have allowed to
figure
there's a lot of questions that
i think as you can fill this out
even my process is different
i have a design process that we solve a
puzzle
and try and get numbers from contractors
which we all know have gone like this
right
everyone's scheduled everyone sits on
the board
coming in front of you sometimes with
items that we don't know what it's going
to cost
for instance it could be that we would
like to be deciding on the addition
we have enough money we'd like to
recycle the whole home
but we don't have the numbers back there
so we're going to tell homeowners let's
wait so you get numbers back
from the quarter
that's not started right
if you want to talk about graphically
maybe i'm a dinosaur still use my hand i
won't put notes all over this but it's
not as easy as turning up layers on your
computer that people come in with cds
already done
that's not my process that's fine i
don't want to be part of the process
but i understand that there's a couple
different approaches to
getting to this point in front of you
and so
i think as you move forward i think the
application could get better
i'm certainly not going to put
does my overhang change to overhang the
rest of the house oh my god i'm not
going to do it
what's the
development coverage on the site i'm not
going to put on this drawing that's not
what i like to bring in front of you i
want to bring to you something that
speaks to the artistic
uh
aspects of this community and
what i do
if you want me to bring target lines up
here i can
find
i
understand i think this is architecture
review it's not
i go in front of a lot of architectural
reports
you have concept review and if you want
us i'll come back for another meeting
you can bring cds back in we can all
look at
details
i don't think
that's the stop that this
community wants to have
so
that's my two cents um
i will tell you that majority of the
time
there isn't much fluctuation between
whatever it comes forward or more so
there are plenty of other
i will use the last strong exit in front
of you as an example in the mission
they're a little big
and so
when you think about
looking for dimensions and targets and
things like that
i'm all in i will do
players to it you uh glorified
or dumbed down
i understand
anyway thanks very much no absolutely
and again i think it's it's it's good to
have public discussion about the process
but how will we know
when the guidelines get published before
we just gotta stand on the detective
it'll be on the website this is the very
first time we're bringing it up to this
board
so this was gonna be our last thing on
our agenda so i don't i'm gonna
try to sum it up because we're gonna do
a whole presentation at the end but
i i don't know because
i i don't know because they're
guidelines not standards
you know they're guidelines and
standards but if i could just the
process is that we bring them here first
and then they will also go to be zap and
we will take as long as we need to
answer your question to circulate them
to get comments
as soon as i have a comfort level from
this board who is the sponsor of the
design guidelines that it is publishable
i mean i can share them with anybody at
this point they're kind of out there but
i'm not going to publish them on the
website until they're i mean there's
still typos and stuff so you know
but it'll it'll definitely be on the
list it's not just something it's like
we
and these these are not these are not
ordinances they're guidelines
um that support the ordinances
but they're there to support you
and and your applicants they're not
meant to be
um
you know adversarial they're meant to be
and i think you will find them
especially
you
and other designers who are very
talented
they should be your friend like this
should be really helpful it's an
educational choice remember
seaside out of florida you told everyone
what they could do
and their zoning code went to a 24-36
inch forward
instead of
and i think this document is also very
interesting because it gets into the
history of the neighborhoods of bexling
right so it breaks down what happened
it's very very interesting
soon yeah come on
pete all right
good night
i'm at 119 119
our next application is arb 2252 119
south remington applicant is andrew
hanna owner is andrew hanna the
applicant is requesting architectural
review and approval and certificate of
appropriateness for a covered porch
patio addition and modification
that's family
kathy would you please please state your
name andrew hannah
do you solemnly swear or from the
testimony you're about to give this
evening is the truth i do thank you
uh similar similar case to 211
kassingham except
bad news for me is i did do my own
drawings
um karen do you want do you want to
start or yeah i usually do start so we
we're we're kind of out of whack tonight
i think a little bit but i usually do
it's not good it's not you at all
it's just the
it's weird tonight but um i had a very
similar conversation with
mr hannah basically ditto what i had
with matt dallendorf
totally understand the intent
the drawings are just not clear um i did
and i'm it's not coming up on my screen
but i'm hoping that you guys can see
it's it's i put together a pdf for you
with pictures of the house okay which
i'm hoping you all can see
more easily than i'm having
i'm having little it must be a big file
um but i did do
i'm hoping that all the board members
can see the photos of the house
it's crystal clear what you want to do
once we talked it through right and
we've already had this conversation also
i just need the drawings to get to a
different point
um
which we already talked about as well
and in the same way that i approached
the first project i
also said to mr hanna it's at the
pleasure of the board whether the
drawings come back to me or whether you
get tabled and come back here
um
so i will leave it to the board to have
that
discussion um
just like we did on the other case but
you're welcome to chime in on your
intent or design idea
i think it's pretty clear you the where
the porch goes these they're not my
other my computer is now misleading
those were aesthetic examples uh kind of
from somewhere around the neighborhood
there and just some online and it's in
the back of my house um there's a
there's my house is l-shaped and it's an
infill section which is not visible
except for one just one window from my
neighbor's house here we go um so
yeah
there's the driver this is why i wanted
to bring up the pictures this is exactly
the spot so so you can see that once we
put together all this information i can
understand what what is going to happen
but we just need to get the drawings to
them and so the intent is to basically
redo the back that asphalt hold there's
a little
jump back there clean that up
concrete have a little infill of blue
stone pavers it still functions as a
driveway but then we're putting a cover
you know patio over there kind of
putting in a new door
amending that window to a man door
you can't see but on the inside there's
two different levels there and it's kind
of a wonky setup so we wanted to swap
out those two windows in the corner with
the door
but other than that we're basically just
filling in that section and putting a
roof over it
that's your only access to the garage
correct no there's there's a door in the
back which we use i mean i've maybe
pulled through the back there four times
and however long we were there six years
okay um yeah so there's a there's a
garage door on the back which is in one
of those pictures and that's what we use
for access
oh there it is uh those are house facing
then there's more on the back also from
the alley
also of notes
you guys have checked a lot of boxes
here but this is the first of we want to
redo the whole outside and so under that
porch where it's not visible we wanted
to start the new siding which would be
hardy and then you know in the next year
or so we'll replace all siding
it's old final
as you can see
so i think in this case we're looking
for
a nod of of like yeah this looks like a
good project come back
with drawings
um and i you know we talked about those
already but i thought it was fair to
hear kind of your reaction to this also
just of note since you brought it up
when you do um
go to do the rest of the house recited
that doesn't need to come to the board
just through just through me oh okay
okay
is there any anyone in the audience that
has standing that would like to speak to
this case
hearing none
comments from the board
there you go okay
yeah i agree um
come back with
uh
more information
exactly what karen was talking about
uh and then uh we can react to it the
concept of where you want to put it
sounds great
um
you know
i think you had fun with bluebeam
[Laughter]
so
i did yes
uh i could tell that so um but yeah just
the concept of it is great and i'm glad
that like you're investing in your house
and it's gonna it is gonna be really
nice just yeah bring back stuff that we
can
really look at and comment on
do you do you have a designer working
with you on this or is it just you i'm
actually a builder and a developer i was
hoping not to engage in architect i'm
probably going to after sitting through
this meeting tonight
um we'll certainly get some elevations
and whatever obviously we'll throw in
whatever dimensions you want now you
know now construction
well my recommendation is to to find an
architect who understands the details of
bexley because
there are things like when you put hardy
onto a building that that didn't
previously have hardy you have to
rethink your window trim
completely it's a very different animal
yeah
so you have to consider that um also
what is good precedent versus bad
precedent in bexley for a lot of a lot
of those details and proportions
like this south roosevelt house i will
just state for the record that this
house was not built according to the arb
recommendations
um and some of the details yeah so
the the porch on the front
on south roosevelt so be very careful
about what you're pointing to
in terms of
material and details
um
for instance you know if you're pointing
to the siding and the window trim okay
but zoom in on that don't show me the
whole facade show me exactly what you're
looking at that's the reference point
okay because those piers and that and
tablature or the beam detail are not
what we had asked them to do on that
particular project
and and that's that there's a whole
other story that we've been dealing with
here
so i'm clear you want to go that far
in this board i wasn't sure when it
comes when it comes to porches and
things that are additions to existing
houses
this is what gives the character of our
city okay
um and and really for anything for new
builds as well it's it's important that
those details be commensurate with what
we have across the city so i love the
energy you put into it where you're
focusing in on certain details but
really get in on it say this is the kind
of window trim i want to use right here
but if you just show me a whole facade
of a house and say i kind of like this
that's that's not going to tell us where
you're going
there's there's a lot of leeway there
and then in terms of uh
the the porch itself
i guess i just want clarity are you
intending to block up those three
windows and then take this porch all the
way to that brick wall yes okay
so the drawing that you have on the last
page or sorry the c1 page
it's kind of unclear
and so you need to show more of the
house
show me show me the whole house in plan
even if it's just an outline
and then show the porch so we understand
show the drive show what you're doing
with the and you can explain this to
your architect or your designer whoever
you're going to be engaging
and then the detail of the um section
you know through the porch
we just need
we need to see that in elevation you
know a front view of it a side view of
it and all that which i'm sure ms boker
has explained
and really concentrate for us on the
details you know what is what is the
capital what is the pier made of what
does it look like how does the beam work
how does the uh
what size rafters are inside we don't
really care you know what we care about
is that all the engineering details on
there yeah engineering is great i mean
it's important for you to work that out
but for us um what's more important is
is the exterior what the final result is
going to be
so other than that i really don't have
any other comments i'll look forward to
seeing this again thanks
love the energy though
thanks
mr steele
um
i would say my biggest thoughts are
related where
in height this this roof is going to
exist because there's a lot going on
with roofs
on this house and how it's going to
return
on the back of the house and how
different things are going to line up
i'm with in the drawings and we know
they're not
done at this point yeah where is this
one this is going to be at where the
brick transitions to the siding where is
it going to
where are these transitions going to
happen and i'm
uh there's going to be some design
necessary to to make it all work
especially when you get towards the back
of the house yeah that shutter comes out
so my intent was where you see the top
of the windows there and the top of that
door basically there's your ledgers and
your beams and then i had a low
roof like a i think a 212 312
um which keeps it well under the upper
windows
where is the gutter line at the back of
the house so the gutter there there is
actually no gutter it comes in that you
see it in the corner there on the left
there's nothing there at all it all
comes to the left and so the face the
gutter will go up obviously on the face
and they'll y end together where that
on the left of the on the existing west
elevation of the house where
yeah there you go it comes to the back
so that's independent um none of that
drains to where the porch is going
so the porch would be independent but
the gutter
on the face of the porch would why into
the one you can see on the left in the
in the brick yeah there you go which is
over here yeah yes and then
yeah it'll go forward and then this goes
all the way back to this
which we'll go back to this very well
everything on the back comes to the back
which
is the spot on the right
oh yeah
yeah that grows away yeah that's just
from that road
your site plan indicates that the garage
is
16.6 feet from the house
and i just want to make sure that where
you're placing this addition that it
won't interfere with access to both
parking spaces
from the driveway it would
likely interfere with the lawn to the
farthest south
um
so you'd be eliminating one of your
parking spaces i could still get in
there but i would have to maneuver i
can't just pull i wouldn't be able to
just pull straight back in and out okay
you could still get in you just have to
maneuver
i i just wanna
so if if he does eliminate it by the
design a parking space what does that
kick in his process that he'd have to go
through does he have to do another
garage variants
i can still get into the garage in the
other door i know and then that's just
to the one side but the the side that's
more interior to the lot where the door
isn't
you know you're supposed to have two
off-street parking spaces and also in
the code regarding garages if you you
know removed a two-car garage you'd have
to at least put back a two-car
so
so it just
i have to question
a modification to the house that would
prohibit you from using both spaces as
it's intended would that kick it to
these apps for variance i don't know i'd
have to or you could put a door back
here another door yeah that's true
uh i would like to make that an 18-foot
door i mean that would solve your
problem yep
okay
does that need to come before the
architectural review board because i've
already got three guys karen can do that
i can do that i already have guys
sending me quotes for that anyway yeah
no and that would take care of the
problem anyway but like these are all
kinds of problems that will come up when
we have the drawings in front of us to
like
you see like
i didn't want to cut you to get beat up
tonight but i wanted you to get some
feedback on your
now that i've gone through the process
yeah next time i know okay
and we also want to make sure that
you've got a two-car garage that
functions yeah
i just thought it was worth mentioning
even though all this stuff is going to
fall out when you like open up
[Laughter]
i'm telling you it needs a little little
cleanup here
so do you want to ask for it to be table
then uh yeah what what do i need to
formally say
people hold on oh sorry
do we want a table to a certain day
go ahead no no no do we want to go
says you're painting the brick are you
painting all the brick of the house just
just work eventually yes right now i
just want to do this section that's
under the porch because again it's not
visible from anywhere else
i noticed the house is two different
color brick anyway or i can yeah i look
like it might have been repaired
somebody probably infilled a porch at
one point
yeah
the car i mean it's it's the front of
the house that has there's one photo
right there yeah right there i think
that was probably a porch at one point
and the the back brick looks like it's
original the front brick looks new
it's just on that corner it's got a
different if you look closely there's a
different score pattern oh it's and it
has an interesting uh
at the base there's a the actual hole
pattern
i'm assuming maybe they use those weeps
it's i've just never
it's just interesting that's what it
looks like and i'm pretty sure it's not
sure it's used for that also
uh it looks like are you re relocating
your electric both hvacs and your gas
service then yes
do you know where you're relocating your
hvc condensers yeah i noted that on
there so right see where my neighbors is
there um
basically back there so it will be
further back
closer to the fence back there yep
so uh back basically back by those
bushes
right yeah
yeah there you go so either side of the
house yeah
yeah so there's special reques specific
requirements for location of the
condensing units screening three foot
back from the property line and
screening
okay that's all i had and obviously i
agree with all the comments tonight look
forward to seeing this come back
when you pick the brick out to infill
for those windows
make sure you're picking a brick that's
texture matches the existing be very
careful about that if i'm being honest i
i believe i'm gonna end up keeping those
windows
getting rid of windows yeah that's if i
have to redo the plans anyway
i intend to keep the window but my guess
is after you paint it you you would
always see it yeah maybe your visitors
wouldn't but you would
i like having them and i kind of just
wanted a hard stop there on the porch
but after after review i'd like to keep
those windows
okay and i need at least a dd set of
plans as well
sounds like this evening okay
so
are you requesting to be tabled uh i am
can you have a table to october 13th
yes
so if somebody wants to make that
emotion do we have a motion so moved
second
roll call please mr hired yes mrs krosky
yes mr steele yes chairman scott yes
you
thank you appreciate it thank you
our next applicant is arb 2253
2010 east broad street applicant is
brent foley owners catholic diocese of
columbus the applicant is requesting
architectural review and approval and a
certificate of appropriateness for a
renovation to the exterior and the
interior of the building
hello
my name is casey burns
please raise your right hand do you
solemnly swear or from the testimony
you're about to give this evening is the
truth yes thank you
and who are you are you with casey burns
let's try our trial architects okay
okay
staff report all right this um
application is kind of
i'll call it phase two i don't know if
that's what you're calling it or not
um but as you know the gymnasium
space
is under construction and
we now have the second phase of this
which is
i'm going to let you talk about the
specifics of the design but it's the
extrusion of the existing open space
um
into more usable space
and a second story it does
match the master plan which we um have
some sketches that have been included
this was
part of what was approved as a master
plan
um
you can also see it here
there's a kind of a red
dotted line just for those of you who
haven't looked in the drawings yet in
the audience around where this part of
the project is
um and then some photographs
i don't know yes and i'm happy to flip
back and forth as you need to describe
things
um
in the plants
um
i think this is very well executed i had
i had the whole design explanation by
brent
um
i'm sorry to see he's not here yes he is
very sorry yes
that's what i assumed um
so i'm gonna let you talk about the
design it's very much in keeping with
what was approved by the master plan it
looks great i had a lot of great
feedback from all board members um
but i probably
if looking this in a vacuum i would have
put it in a consent agenda item but i
think with a project that's as visible
and prominent as this should have a full
hearing so we'll go ahead and hand it
over to our chairman here to lead the
discussion if you want to add one thank
you yeah do you have anything you want
to
talk about or present to us tonight just
um as uh clarification so the building
footprint
the expansion is within the building
footprint of the existing gym
um now that we have the convocation
center underway um the gym should we
would like to utilize it as classroom
space and the learning resource center
and
taking advantage of the construction i
think we're doing it now
expanding from two stories up to four
stories gives
double the space
double the square footage for additional
classrooms to serve as school so that
was our intent keeping within the
building footprint but um expanding
working
could you talk about the concept of the
design and
materials yeah so we um kept the sage
here a lot of the same details that are
prominent on all of the facades of the
sustained buildings um the main
difference
i would say is that we
drew from the limestone vans
um that are present throughout the
building facade and expanded that
so it's a larger limestone band for the
two-story
edition
but it was keeping with the language it
was um
a way to
celebrate the addition while still
keeping the same language of the facade
um so it is prominently limestone um
rather than brick but the top brick
details um around the
roof line and around all of the
storefronts uh match what existing and
speak to
the language of the rest of the
buildings
to keep that consistent
and uh could you just walk us around and
tell us from which points these
perspectives are taken just for clarity
yes so um in this perspective what you
see on the left side is the new
convocation center
um and then that colonnade that walks up
to the right leads to
the walter commons so the limestone and
the archways that you see behind that is
um the expansion of the existing gym um
that
limestone band you see that
um
is kind of the midway point that is the
height of the existing gym yes that one
that's the height of the existing gym um
and then we're raising the existing gym
level up to the height of the existing
height of the walter commons
that's an outdoor space behind the first
three arches though so yes that is an
outer space uh a courtyard um it will be
open air um
it leads right into kind of the
lobby area of the convocation center and
then into the first floor of the
learning resource center so it's all a
very fluid transition between the spaces
and the other if you go to the sketches
that um bob corner did could you explain
the viewpoints from those because i i
think
i'm a little
confused about the what pers where
they're taken from exactly
um yes
which ones the the hand sketches
very first drawing
so that one i understand go to the next
one sorry
or
that one i understand it's from the
football field yeah but the the this one
here where is this taken from so that
one is from uh
i see i'm not the only one
oh okay well without calling it the back
side um so this is um right now there's
uh
it's the east entrance we'll call it
walter commons there's a tunnel um that
runs between
um
actually if you lower your cursor a
little bit that right there is the the
tunnel way that leads between the two
buildings that right now is open and
we'll be enclosed so
um the
addition of the expansion
it's all right yes
from the east
our way over here
okay mr steel would you like to start us
off
that we've already started
i wish i had seen this the complication
stuff in the past and
seen
it go up and
saw some of you guys post some stuff on
your social media actually brandon so uh
the construction with the big p lambs or
something that's happening yes we
haven't been experienced today
it's quite a massive project and it's
really cool
i mean i don't
have anything i've been
saying that i guess at the time
thank you mr
um
the chapel itself
is
the the exterior is brick is it not
so
in traditional architecture limestone is
one step above
in terms of you know quality it's one
step above brick so in a way
this building is stepping above the
chapel but the chapel is not set apart
it's using the same material as the rest
of the whole complex
so i don't think there's an argument to
be made i mean i've thought about this
if the chapel was limestone you'd have
like this
balance between the science building and
the chapel which
i think is great
now that this is the only limestone
building
was there discussion about it being
kind of fancier than anything else on
campus with that material not fancier it
was um
especially this elevation and uh it can
go around the corner the back elevation
it just became one long stretch of brick
so it was really about breaking up the
facade a little bit um so it didn't
become so such a
large singular mass
the intent of it
being
a nicer material or better material that
was not the intent um i see your point
though
but it was more about um breaking up
kind of the massing so it wasn't so
large
and didn't overtake anything
if the limestone has the
in terms of the coursing of the
limestone is it the intention to use
smaller
courses instead of big panels for all of
this i believe larger panels was the
intent it's a thin panel veneer um
so changing the scale of that is not i
don't think that's um
my recommendation would be to
really think about that because i think
the large panels is going to make it
feel over monumental
yeah um if you use more of an actual
course
it breaks it up so it's not just in you
know zipper lines and zip verticals but
to really think about it ashler um that
first of all fits into bexley because
there's lots of bachelor in vex slate
it also breaks down the limestone and
you don't even it could be within a
panel it doesn't have to be like
individual pieces that are mortared
but the idea that the joints are smaller
i think is going to break down this
over monumental scale i love the
contrast
that you're putting up against all this
brick
um and doing something a little
different um i love the brick cornice
idea and that the circle or the the
layer that goes up to that band is brick
and then you start from there and go up
stone yeah um
my one criticism of this besides the
just being careful about the stone
coursing
is the north elevation
and i really struggled with this one
until i had a
conversation with um
somebody in my office
and
i thought of an idea that i'd like to
put forward to you for that north
elevation
i i understand the idea of taking the
earth stop windows and wrapping the
corner okay
because this building is only going to
be
viewed in perspective it's never going
to be a straight on an elevation from
anywhere so seeing more than one side at
a time is it's just part of the language
of saint charles you're always looking
at buildings from an angle
but what i would do
is
because the rectangular glass window
that's between the double
there they just they clash
so my recommendation would be
can you go to that um north elevation
my recommendation i can get my pointer
to work here
yeah
would be to
inset
this area
right here
set it back
so not just the window but the portion
of the facade as well yeah i mean i
would take this limestone dimension
equal it on this side
and then
step back and make this all glass
okay so increase that size yeah step
back from being flush with vr choice
right
if you can do that and then of course
the crown the cornice would also return
so you take the whole thing and return
it back and just make that inset all
glass and the reason why i say that is
because
these windows
have nothing to do with each other
and but if you end the limestone here
you know same thickness is what you have
over here and then just do glass like
you're doing on the east side
that'd be brilliant and that offset
doesn't need to be any more than you
know eight inches or something yeah it
could be minimal it will look dramatic
just because of the shadows exactly and
then the question is how does that
affect you at the ground plane or
whatever the bottom point of this is
does that do anything detrimental to you
or is it simply working it out in plan
i think it's simply working out and
playing um because as you know the first
two floors are set that that box that
we're working within right
um but we are working working this
structure obviously since we're going
vertical um so it would be a study that
i would have to do with plants to make
sure there aren't convoys um i also
worry about that ledge at the base of
that window
how to finish that detail out make sure
there's no water issues
but conversely
you could take the glass and step it out
i just want to break up the plane
because it feels too boxy
and you have two different kinds of
architecture happening at the same time
on this facade and i'd rather have them
recognizing each other but giving
deference to each other you know by
creating a little bit of push and pull
in and out
whereas on the east side
right
i don't see any issue with that at all
it's it's you see that on a lot of
college campuses where the ohio state
does that you know you see these glass
uh facades that have some residual brick
that you know carries through on the
details and it works
but this one
not that one but the the one on the
north is that a west facade or it's the
north facade that's the north facade
thank you this is north right
yeah
this one to me just doesn't it's not
resolved and and this is the one i'm
going to see from clifton every time i
drive by
[Laughter]
but i think you would do yourself a huge
favor um
just
but it also puts an end to
again you're seeing the the ones on the
west
and these at the same time most of the
time right and then the limestone ends
here
and then whatever you do in the middle
is in or out and it's glass you can
continue the brick you know in or out
but
definitely break that and i think that
that would solve it that's my only
criticism otherwise i'm i'm really
looking forward to seeing this going up
thank you
um
everything's already been said
uh
really i just felt like uh and bill made
the point with the limestones if you
just like go down to that
picture right there hello yeah
so like that just feel that that's just
too big of a
panel right um it feels like clunky and
like really top-heavy
i don't think that's what you're trying
to go for so
just reconsider the size and and the
pattern and you know what bill is
talking about
um but i really i love that you're
carrying the band around i like that
you're hitting you know the limestone
that's adjacent like where that band is
down below and i love the top so
thank you
um
i agree with well i agree with all of it
i've said i i think the
the um the material i get why you did it
to break up that i would
frown on having it be all brick
um
because of its scale um
and i i like that it's limestone but i i
also
really think the argument of
this being celebrated as the most
really stand out type of quality of
material
um the details really you know tell the
story for the rest of the building in
the history and and that's
you know i love that you're bringing
those into this and i think that's very
appropriate
um but just kind of celebrate this more
than you know say the chapel is is a
good argument and i'm not sure how you
overcome that um and maybe you don't
maybe you it is what it is and and the
overall argument of um
the details and the materials of that
chapel speak for itself in the history
and you're allowed to do a little bit
here that's different because of of what
you're working with and i think that's a
strong argument so i don't think it's
something that i would um
you know be totally against before i
think it's i think having it be a
different material is a stronger
argument
um
the overall details and things that
you're pulling from i think are very
appropriate uh i think uh mr hyre's
comments about that north facade is also
very appropriate to kind of break that
down a bit um so other than that i have
no other comments i think it's a good
job
i would
just as a precedent
for using limestone
as a material over a chapel material at
a catholic or any christian or
any religion you know where the chapel
or the synagogue or the the mosque is is
the center of that campus
just look at notre dame i mean there are
tons of limestone buildings on that
campus so the argument and and the and
the basilica there is brick
yes it's a yellow brick with lots of
limestone details
but
because everything is so concentrated at
st charles
there's very little to look at whereas
at notre dame you've got what now like
150 buildings or whatever it is now it's
huge so
you don't have that relationship and
that visual like you do here
so i would say that yes normally we
would
we would hope that the
worship space or the the sacred space is
you know on a religious campus is is the
highest and best but
i can tell you lots of examples where
that's not the case so i wouldn't worry
about that but i do think you know to
jocelyn's point um
the monumentality of those big panels is
is a little overwhelming
but
lots of limestone buildings at notre
dame
because they have the money
i would like to see this lighter
material served with the backdrop or
the new shape of the convocation center
and of the chapel um
rather than competing with it but it is
the only material that is that is not
brick so
i'm glad you used the natural material
yes
very happy to see that i think it's a
great choice i just think there's an
argument there about you know the
importance of other structures in the
you know the basis of the entire campus
site
just
i would like to see this
again though i mean i want to see the
final rendition i'd like to see it
come back here
um by speaking for myself so we can see
that north elevation
so we can see the breakdown of the
limestone even if it's not in a sketchup
rendering you know or what is this chaos
or v-ray or something like that actually
i'm not sure what they use yeah but even
if it's not i mean we'll understand it
it's just i i think it'll be important
for us
to see it again it looks like that
sure
please state your name i'm jimmy
you saw me swear
affirm the testimony you're about to
give this evening is the truth i do
thank you
so i want to challenge your thinking for
a second because you talked about just
using smaller limestone which is very
reasonable what you're asking for and
just offsetting that detail eight inches
which is more than this is exactly what
you normally do when you work
so i could understand why you would want
to see it as an architecture because
every time i listen to you i feel like
i'm in class
which is good it's like sorry
that's a good thing no it's enjoying
your life right no it's a good thing but
i think from a practical standpoint
everything you're asking for is very
reasonable and achievable to execute and
it just it would seem to me like we're
talking about reducing the size of
material and putting an eight inch
offset in that wall which normally what
we would do is agree to those conditions
and get it approved through the
architectural
review process which would not impede us
from continuing to move on because we've
got a pretty massive project going on
right now and sequencing the two is
critical so well
let me make a compromise to that yep you
go 200 i was at 300 now i'm going to go
250.
so
we've done this before where instead of
coming back for
the next review in a month
that the redesign is simply sent out to
the board members sure i can do that i
can yeah wait okay yep okay why don't we
just do it why don't we just do it
conditioned
on review by me
which gives me the option of saying
not okay didn't you didn't do the
changes send it to you all via
yeah i'd like to see it either way yeah
no you'll see it
and really it's because it's such it's
such a public
building yeah
for sure
yeah
thank you i didn't know what all the
options were
i got we we um we have uh he's been
listening
we actually have a lot of flexibility on
this board because we're administrative
boards so we really do have a lot of
flexibility so if you get me dr as soon
as you get me drawings i'll send it out
to the board to see it a thumbs up
absolutely
but you know we you just push a button
right in it
no sorry moral come on
i have to make sure it'll work
we all know that's not the case
any other final comments from the board
no just that um it can we make that a
condition is that a condition i'll make
a condition that she shares it with the
board
informally share with the board is what
i would reward it we hear the
what is finding some facts please sorry
come on
that's okay
almost there
okay
so the findings the fact decision of the
board for application number
arb-22-53 for property located at 2010
east broad
the architects review board finds that
the phase ii renovation and expansion of
the building in accordance with the
approved master plan
is architecture compatible with the
existing structure and further moves to
approve a certificate of appropriateness
with the following conditions that the
limestone panels be of a smaller scale
to the north
elevation to be inset
in the center section of the second
floor
eight inches
i don't know if i needed to put a
specific inside okay
and
offset
further subject to final design review
by the design consultant who will
informally share with the board
you understand these findings of fact
yes
they have a motion
so moved
second roll call please
two all right uh mr steele yes
ms krosky yes
mr heyer yes
sherman scott yes thank you thank you
very well presented thank you
nice job
our next applicant is
be zapp 2235
545 north drexel applicant zahar
el-kisabi
i think i've got close to that and the
owner is mohamed el-sayed the applicant
is requesting an a recommendation to the
board and zoning and planning for
architectural review and approval and a
certificate of appropriateness for a
pergola a deck in the hot tub which
requires a variance from the north side
plot line can i have staff
report please yeah this is a little bit
this is an unusual case in that there is
a full scale model for your observation
built on site meaning it was already
built
um we've had a nice conversation about
this and i've talked to both my cheer
person and kathy
as the zoning officer and so you're
aware already of what i'm going to say
but i just wanted to fill in the
audience
and um those that didn't understand it
in my staff report if i wasn't clear but
i i really would strongly suggest and
it's at the pleasure of the board that
we forego a design
conversation about this right now it is
built
i would say that
we don't even my recommendation is not
that you send a recommendation in the
positive or the negative that you just
move this to be zap with the condition
that it be remanded back here for design
review if the zoning is approved
it just seems very backward to have a
um a design discussion for something
that's already been built and we don't
even know if the zoning
is going to be approved so um that
that's just my feeling we talked a lot
kathy and i talked through this a lot
so so did mr scott and i and you seemed
very comfortable as the applicant when i
told you the thinking but
i just want to know if that's okay with
the rest of the board um but we need to
swear you in
please state your name muhammad saying
you saw me swear or firm the testimony
you're about to give this evening is the
truth yes thank you
do you have anything that you wanted to
add
no i want to see how the conversation is
going to go first if we're doing a
review today so i can embark on
discussing the plans or if we're not
doing a review we're going to move to
zoning because this is really what i am
after zoning is
if zoning approve it then i can come
back and explain what the story is if
zoning doesn't approve it this means
that it's going the design is going to
change anyway we're going to have to set
it back three
three feet well about a foot and a half
because it's a foot and a half from the
property
great
i think our conversation earlier today
was clearly
oh yeah that would be good
yeah i'm trying to write the right
things up there
i want to be clear making sure the board
understands i think
my position on this is that
we can have a dialogue on what's there
but without there's no reason for us to
be able to recommend anything until
zoning
sees this and there's two issues because
it could dramatically change and and we
can't recommend something that that is
already built if it was a sketch and a
design we could if that we do that
that's part of the process but this is
already built we have a setback issue
with the hot tub which requires an eight
foot side yard setback
and an uncovered deck can encroach four
feet into the
side yard setback which in this case is
eight feet
however it's it's confusing when you
look at the photos and you look at the
drawing
where the arbor ends as compared to
where the deck ends
so it's a little bit
in
science i need i need a specific measure
two feet
okay two feet so the
so this where you say the deck ends it's
two feet behind it there and the deck is
one point one and a half feet from the
fence or the property line
and do you know if the fence is on the
property line i do not
okay
we need to find this stuff out i think i
think the fence is on the property line
the fence was existing when i bought the
house yeah
so i can't say that they built it on the
property line but on the other side they
built it on the property line so i can
only assume that this one is also on the
property line and this is all this is
why i recommend that we just go on i
just have a couple questions
is the construction done
yes
this is the restriction
can you can you go to a photo for me
right here
this one
that one
up once i think
zoom out
one more
there you go that's one zoom in to the
right side
so again not not to really review the
design um
but just quickly looking at this
structure
you have the right smaller pergola
on the outside is double beam with your
can you scroll up anymore
yeah this has happened roof choice for
your
your main choice and then you have your
top pieces but that's they are sitting
on the left side sitting on a
horizontally flat two by four or two by
six
so
one that wouldn't be that on the science
side that that's appropriate not going
to really get into that yet structurally
not really working either so
i would be very you know however this
moves forward if there's things that are
getting cut off that's going to be
something that we're going to really
want those details are pretty important
and then you have you you've used you've
kind of stepped the pergola down i'm
getting into the design of this
well i was going to say a lot of this is
going to be dealt with by the city by
the city yeah
once we figure out how much we're
keeping on this we're going to talk
about how much we how much changes you
guys want me to do
yes yeah i think that's the appropriate
course of action so i just
saw that and i was like no absolutely
extension and that's not important so
we're making a motion to uh reckon we're
reckoning we're making a recommendation
to be zap
i would say we're
moving it yeah
without a recommendation
i recommend that we move it to
bzap i would make a motion i would make
a motion to move this to be zapped
without that recognition
i just don't want to use the word
recommendation because um it just
implies that you're giving it a positive
recommendation and you don't want to do
either you just want to say move it to
these apps i make the motion that we
move this to be zapp
without without recommendation i think
that's important yeah we don't need to
add remand that's up to them
it's up to them
okay
i think yeah
then the city's going to be reviewing it
too i mean the building department said
you want me to free the findings and
incorporate that
is there anyone here with standing that
wants to speak to this case this
applicant okay
do you understand the
findings of fact well should you read
that and i also want to share one of my
concerns is the fact that this has not
been inspected
or planned so we we not sure if it's
safe so it's disconcerting and i just
want you to be aware
okay okay so the findings of fact and
decision of the board for application
number
bcap-22-35 for property located at 545
north drexel
the board
moves to recommend
to remand to recommend this to the bees
border zoning and planning without a
recommendation based on the after the
fact review
um
for this
dec and pergola edition
you understand the findings of fact i
think we have a motion
so moved second
second
roll call
ms kraske
uh yes
mr steele yes mr heyer yes chairman
scott yes thank you thank you thank you
our next applicant is bzap 2236
address is 277 south cassidy applicant
is kim mechanic architect owner is
brandon lumbra the applicant is
requesting a recommendation to the board
of zoning and planning for architectural
review and approval and a certificate of
appropriateness for a new garage which
requires a variance for height and
square footage
please we're even
please state your name kim mechanic
do you solemnly swear or affirm the
testimony you're about to give this
evening is the truth yes thank you you
have staff report please i do um
i also have spoken with this applicant i
don't remember who was today or
yesterday but um about um
the fact that this is
um
a a large garage for this size a lot
and we have just wanted to make well
this is not the zoning hearing i wanted
to make sure the applicant and all the
board members in the audience are aware
that we worked pretty hard on a garage
code modification to make sure that
eve lines and footprints
stay within a certain
box depending on what the residential
district is
having said that anyone's welcome to
come and plead the practical difficulty
to the board of zoning and planning
for
a variance to those
conditions
this
this board should approach this as if it
was going to be approved by zoning is it
architecturally appropriate
not whether or not it should be because
it is clearly and we've spoken about
this
oversized um it is detailed pretty
nicely there is a facade that
did not have a window on it but it's the
skinny facade we just talked about this
so um
i i
it is detailed nicely with nice garage
doors and
um
you know
i'm going to leave it to the board you
can go ahead and present you can mention
the hardship but it's really not
relevant here but
whatever i mean
one of the the bearings we were
requesting is the e fight being in 10
foot instead of knife
and it's the owner has a piece of
similar equipment that is hoping to use
it set in one of the bays and just
wanting to just have a little more
ceiling fight in there for that reason
and then for easy construction just
stick with it trying to type trust so
that's why we asked for that um
as far as the square footage i believe
we're
13 feet over the
maximum allowed
and
where we had gotten to that is the owner
wanted to have um nine foot for three
garage doors to be nine foot wide doors
and
it just allowed a little bit more ease
of installation have nine cents and big
foot doors
otherwise we're within
our ridge height is
you know
within the
maximum allowed and we're within all the
uh setbacks
i believe from you know side yard and
from the house and everything from that
from that aspect
uh the ridge height is 18 feet 6 inches
and the height limit i believe is 18.
and just to note the i thought it was
20.
18.6 in the drawings appears to be to
the top of ridge right because then it
says
yeah allowable ridge height not to
exceed 20 feet above the grade so and
just graphically shown that way i'm not
sure that's exactly
uh
18 feet 18 sixes to the top of the ridge
beam how about the ridge beam okay
not the top of the roof
so that's a little confusing just
graphically shunned that way maybe it
might be i'm just saying that looking at
it
i also wanted to point out to board
members that um may not have been able
to see the backyard in any drive-bys i
put together pictures kind of at the
last minute so if you if you looked at
if you looked at this before this
afternoon i don't know that i had done
it yet but i put together kind of a pdf
of
um because one of the things that you
know i noticed right away are the boxees
so i wanted to make sure that those kind
of details
match that of the existing house
i will need to make sure i revisit that
to share with the owner and the builder
that
it's done correctly yes
is there anyone in the audience that has
standing that would like to speak to
this case
before the board speaks
seeing none
mr steele would you like to lead us off
so you you'd say
our comments are purely designed not
yeah
yeah having said that it's always tricky
because design still can be a massing
issue
i think this is very nicely proportioned
and detailed with the exception of some
eaves need to match the existing house
etc but you know i appreciate the choice
of the garage doors being
what do they have windows and panels
so yeah
yes it is about architectural design
there are cases that we've seen i'm just
educating you know it's just
ratification that that amassing can
because of a zoning ass can make
something architecturally inappropriate
i don't really find that to be the case
personally in this but that's your
discussion not mine
can i see those photos sure
there's the front
consisting garage
what's the size of the existing garage
i believe it's like 20 by it's like
about 20 by 20. okay thanks
remember
i mean the only the thing that stands
out to me the most is this the
difference in the siding sizes
the existing house versus the addition
and i mean
perhaps that's a cost thing but
and you're there's a vinyl that they're
going to install
that's really my own is that cedar
shape
they're more specific
yeah
i mean that and perhaps the other window
side was kind of kind of match existing
that's all
skrt
is the issue the simulator itself or is
it did he swing the golf club inside the
space this
golf club inside the space i have to
admit i've not seen the actual
i think it's for swinging the golf
course
inside the space
[Music]
we could go this route and
ask for univariance so
i don't think it supposed to be how you
accept the equipment maybe you have to
be closer to the um edges of the tab
really close to let's say the walls
where you have the lower ease height so
then that
doesn't help your own high points in the
middle
um
you ask them about the equipment some
more i mean it's projection onto the
screen
moved recently to the area so i don't
think he had that here so i didn't get
to see it
um
i don't have any issue with the three
bay in this neighborhood where it is are
there any trees that are coming out for
this to happen because there's some
trees on the in that alley
um
or on you know on your property there's
a big pine tree that's still there
i just want to make sure you're still
going to have that beautiful
foliage
i believe most of our trees were
i mean there's
probably the with them right
and jason obviously would go away but
well
he's on a corner a lot yeah so they have
some streets are further closer to the
street but the garage is visible when
you're on dale
yes right
and the neighbor to the west has a big
open
lawn
so you're looking right at this garage
when you're coming when you're driving
east on dale correct
yeah yes so this is very visible garage
on that and that's why i think you know
the foliage the trees are important to
keep
um and i could and i have to admit i
didn't
particularly survey the trees that were
near
but we could take a closer look and make
sure
i
what's saying or
that we don't
take any really any way i i've had to
revisit that honestly
um
yeah i mean
so the height to me it's not about the
ridge height although you could easily
solve that by going to a 712 instead of
an 8 12.
yeah
the ridge doesn't match
right i guess we're that's that's
important too but i'm saying that you
know
if if for instance bzap said yeah we
don't have a problem with your your
10-foot eve but we do have a problem
with your 18-6 to the ridge beam just
you know you go to 712 because it's not
matching anything on the existing house
that i can tell you have a hipped roof
at the back and the front has funny
gables
so i wouldn't worry about that okay and
i had to look like
we were kind of stuck on
my suggestion though is that you should
lower the eve you know just pull
everything down but why not if you go to
the elevation of the uh
of the garage
i'm wondering if you just don't for one
of the bays raise the collar tie so that
he gets the height that he wants he'll
have a little bit of a slope at the edge
but the collar tie will be up an
additional foot
so where is this where's the height
issue where does he want to have the
height is it in here is it yeah
yes so why not just raise the collar tie
in this bag
and all this you know
if you raise the collar tie you can
bring the e back down and then you don't
have a variance at all
well except for the square footage yeah
and i know i'm just thinking about that
i think we're talking nine 36 36 square
feet i was 37.
but i'm i might as in terms of design
and in this neighborhood i really think
that eve needs to be down at our
regulation
but if you can convince your
your um client to
raise the color types because that's not
a complicated detail no no
i agree and they could raise it more
than a foot
it could be up a foot and a half two
feet whatever in order to make that
happen before we get any further now let
me point this out so in your can you go
to the section please
you your ten foot
height bearing is very tight that bottom
about a two by ten maybe fascia two by
eight two two eight eight inch fascia
you might be right at nine feet to the
bottom of eve
which means you have no variance that's
just a square footage that very square
footage and then if you drop
your slope to seven and a half twelve
you're probably below the ridge height
seven seven twelve seven and a half
months so now you have a square footage
which is minimal you still have to go to
b's app but you're minimal and also
going to be up with the context of
clarifying and lowering the roof a
little bit is a is a big yeah and there
would be no i mean absolutely i don't
disagree that you could still do a
collar time maybe they can get 11 feet
because it's all about this i'm swinging
a golf club i need 11 feet well i feel
like 10 feet
is probably pushing it for
to swing one but he seemed to be a
little bad but i don't think he loses
that i don't i think the issue is
getting the right information it's the
bottom side of the eve that needs to be
dimensioned
i
[Music]
bearing but i see that well and that's
an important dimension yes yeah no
that's not you just see the dimension
what the bottom the most bottom part of
the eave is that needs to be at nine
feet
and i would highly recommend getting um
i don't want to jump in
drop your
dimension to the top of shingle
but drop that below
okay 18
this soffit height at nine right right
yep okay you're close don't make your
facial like two and a half feet high
though
right now if that helps that would be
come back to us if you can get rid of
any square footage the
teeniest may not have to go anywhere
else
yeah i mean
but you could even drop your bearing
down four four inches yeah yeah and do a
little bit of that collar tie and
it's not gonna affect the gameplay and
it's only for one bay you know for one
bag i think there's plenty of really
you're so close
okay now that that all makes sense
calculation for square footage on the
garage to the exterior or the interior
walls
exterior
so
so are you making a recommendation i'm
not i'm just pointing out the drawings
yeah
i'm going to let mr trump adjust to the
modifications and just leave it back let
me see what you guys modified
notifications because she has the 10
feet at the rafter bearing and not at
the
bottom
okay
is there any way that you can get the um
your client
to do
this a siding besides vinyl
i will have to ask i think it's it'll be
a budgetary thing okay
again because this garage and its
location
sits so forward of the house to the west
it really is a prominent garage and to
have
that house if i was that homeowner i
would not be happy
to see a three-car vinyl garage that i
have to look at out my front window
every day right um
so i i really think that's important
that the materials be
um
you know in keeping with the house
uh as much as possible
um i also would say from my point of
view the nine foot
soffit height is
is critical that's a condition from in
terms of design from my point of view
just because of the location of the
garage and realizing
looking at
i think that's attainable then for the
ninth of
side
also bring the bridge down
yeah those are easy changes yes
i think you know the other elements
because i think you have you're calling
out
vinyl top casing is around your doors
and your vinyl trim it's a lot of vinyl
details that i would recommend going and
adding some
other materials to help trim those
things out uh and i would be in full
support of a different material other
than vinyl i think that's that's just
not appropriate i mean it's i understand
why people use it but it's just not
appropriate yeah i think if this was an
interior lot where you're not at a
corner and this garage isn't so
prominent it wouldn't be such a big deal
but this this is a prominent view for
people in bexley driving by yeah
so it's almost like its own house you
know on the street
yeah i i understand
and then i think the way you detail the
the ends of your
thieves
at the gable ends
is something that um
i'd like you to continue to look at and
do a little bit more traditional yep i'm
i'm all over that one lately
and then what is
what
we're doing a six foot eight door
you see the proportion of the door in
the window everything just seems
they feel in this drawing and i think
it's the height of the eve
that those doors feel like they're kid
doors
and proportionally so you know
i mean yeah i guess usually i wouldn't
even
it's just in the proportions of the
elevation so i'll double check that i
would look at options of maybe looking
at a seven foot door even and raising
the window a little bit just to change
that proportion a little bit especially
if you drop that eve down a couple
inches sure
i think that'll help tie that together
i know that he's not going to want
any more windows in the building
especially on the golf simulator side
but
with a three-bay garage just having a
single window i know there's windows in
the garage doors which is nice
i appreciate that but um and it would be
nice to have a side window on the ends
of the garage
especially the one facing dale if
possible yeah i would highly i would
almost make that a condition i think
this this is is getting it's looking at
the site plan the proportion of it
versus the house and the site i don't
feel like it's oversized it's obviously
a little bit over what the record the
zoning is but it feels proportionate i
think with a little bit shallower roof
it'll it'll the size will come down a
bit you know the proportion of the door
in the window
header hike you know
maybe get increased maybe not maybe
because it'll be better when it drops
but right
you know all those little things will
fine-tune this this project and
having another window again he doesn't
want one on the golf simulator side but
he's not going to have that forever so
that garage is going to be a garage
forever so
having those end windows are really nice
in index these garages
now woody if we and i agree we should
have a side window especially facing
that street would we need one on that
side where we're kind of like left looks
like it's right up against the fence
okay but
how many houses do because fences come
and go but i agree it's not a condition
of the project okay
so this is a recommendation to be zapp
and i've got with conditions to lower
eaves
and
add a condition of a 9 foot eave with
dimension to be cleared clarified
18 foot to top of so do they need to
lower the eaves or just define the eaves
at nine
feet uh
clarify making sure they're at nine feet
yeah without making the faces larger
that's important
yeah
yeah that's important you can't just use
a 2x12
you want me to add without making the
fascia larger yes please
record yeah
granted you do have a longer distance to
slope so we we get that but
we can attain that though without
going crazy how's the board making me
and at a side window on the daily avenue
side window garage conditioning i think
so i think so too
the north side and then
recommend looking at the door window
height it's not a condition details to
match exactly
details to match principle structure
materials
not a condition
i think that's what we've been on yeah i
mean i'd like to see if we can
uh understanding economics at least get
it to visually match better
i mean
we find a suitable mostly vinyl siding
but we take our trim to
not take that vinyl but
final trim is a nice wood trim it's
awful right
you can do you could do a combination
you can do that yeah you can do the trim
around the doors and windows in
oh you could do it in cedar you could do
it in azac you know or one of the
composite material
right something that looks more
in keeping with the character of the
house and that will actually make the
vinyl look better yes especially if you
get a quality looking vinyl product it
helps because it's it adds those details
that make a difference to to the
architects and people who notice those
things
sorry exactly here join me to read the
findings
so the findings of fact and decision of
the board for application number bzap
22-36 for property located at 277 south
cassidy the architecture review board
recommends a certificate of
appropriateness
to the board of zoning and planning with
the following conditions
that the applicant clarify eaves to nine
feet without making the fascia larger
that a side window be added to the dale
avenue side of the building
uh this is i don't know if i mentioned
for a 20 by 30 detached garage
and that the details are to match the
principal structure
ridge has to be
at 18 feet and ridge reached no
reference no taller than 18 feet
as no coverage
the bridge height
close yeah
okay do you underst do we need to read
that again are you good
i think we're good
you gotta understand the findings of
fact
do you understand the findings of facts
we have emotion
so moved
second seconded
mr steele
yes mr heyer yes
ms krosky yep
chairman scott yes
thank you
kathy i need those
our last application tonight is arb
22-49 b-zap 22-39
address is 2735 allegheny the applicant
is curtis and megan allman the owner is
curtis and megan allman
the applicant is requesting a
recommendation to the board and zoning
and planning for architectural review
and approval and a certificate of
appropriateness for an addition to the
rear of
principal structure which needs a
variance to the side yard setback
okay
however please whatever you want to roll
is what i adjust
thank you
okay i'll give a little background and
then you can
talk about
everything that we talked about already
probably
um again we have spoken which i do all
the with every applicant so they're not
surprised by anything they're gonna hear
um this application is for an addition
to the rear of the principal structure
and it is basically just
the center hallway and building back
um i had some concern of what was on the
site plan from i think the auditor's
website i kept saying garage but i think
it's just a shed that's actually going
away so one of my concerns which is
being
close to a garage within 10 feet is
alleviated because i'm on on um mr
almond site plan you can see that that's
already taken off but i was paying more
attention i guess to the
auditor's website so he helped me um
clarify that just to make sure
that we're clear
we did however talk about
the edition
and the shape of the edition and the
um
awkwardness i guess is the way i would
put it as a designer of the center
hallway that just goes from front to
back
and what kind of spaces that sets up and
what kind of massing
um opportunities are kind of lost on the
outside by doing that um
we also talked about and and then we had
a conversation about well the foundation
he'll go ahead and explain his reasoning
so the next conversation that we had was
okay for a sake of argument let's say
you do do this design
um
which i already explained the board will
probably not look so favorably upon the
very long narrow
um
structure
that at least we could talk about some
of the differences we might be able to
do in windows i there is a tendency in
bexley and we have this whole
conversation to match match match match
match but sometimes the original
architecture isn't worth matching and
you have an opportunity to do
a design in the back of this house that
may be better than what's in the front
and i no disrespect to your house but
you know we can see in the pictures
which um
i'll bring up the kind of
i don't know what to call them for lack
of a better term some of the 70 shapes
windows that maybe in the new part you
don't want to do that kind of window and
give yourself more light and better
proportion in windows so it's kind of i
i'm throwing a lot out to talk about all
the way from the massing to the details
um but i'm gonna hand it over to you
we've had this conversation already so i
just want to give the board the
background
um
my um
there is a need for
a variance it was originally filed as an
arb but now we have a zoning number also
attached to it so it does
need a variance um
i that's not what that issue today but
it does play into
a little bit
um into the architecture in terms of how
long it is
so i will hand it over to you now to
fill in any gaps i may have left out of
our conversation
thank you very much i appreciate the
opportunity
um i
have not worked with a um architect or a
designer we've had um recently moved to
the area and we bought the house with
the hopes of
a 900 square foot house
we need more room we got two kids under
three one bathroom it's it's a challenge
as it is but we uh we bought the house
with hopes of uh
expanding it um so
you know i i drew up these ideas and the
plans to um extend the house backward
when i was doing research on the the
board here i was under the
impression that
you wanted to keep what was on the
building all the way back you wanted to
be consistent with the structure that's
that's what i grew up with the keeping
the same windows on the side
um
but um
essentially the the challenges of the
lot itself i mean it's 40 foot wide by
120 foot deep um i mentioned the
variance a second ago but we can go into
that a little bit um just to
just expanding the house back uh a dish
uh making the the master it's not really
nasty right now it's another bedroom but
making it a master suite with an ensuite
bathroom and then the other side uh i
work from home um so i need an office
space that that additional bedroom um in
the back right with service kind of
storage and office space as well the uh
the reason you know i went through
several different iterations if you will
the reason of the long haul and is we we
do intend to have the covered portion of
the back and we do you know hopefully
we'll be able to put a privacy fence
around the back of the building and just
sit on the back
and maybe have dinner
watch the kids do what they do
and then let me have access if it is
raining or whatever and really when i
was thinking through the long hallway
situation is we want the square footage
to be in the rooms as limited as it is
and i couldn't figure out how to bend
that hallway or do any of that
that way so i i'd love to hear feedback
i'd love to hear um
thoughts and ideas you are the second
brain trust of designers that
look at this another designer yesterday
and we talked about um he takes he's
going to take the the plans that i have
and put together a contract of actually
doing construction
um and plans to where we can get uh
quotes and do different things like that
but i'd love to hear um feedback and
questions
from you guys
okay
uh is there anyone in the audience
withstanding
no okay uh so let's have a look to the
board mr heyer would you like to start
us off
yeah sure um
i think you really need to have
design real design drawings i mean this
is
we can make recommendations
but
in my mind
the way to describe what i'm what i
would be looking for
i think is better suited for after we
have real design drawings because
to have
a long corridor like that
you know going through the middle of a
house
uh
is something we never do in design
it's it's a deadly
uh i mean i don't mean physically deadly
but mentally and spiritually and and you
know all that it's it's it's
it's something you just don't do
so um
[Music]
i think your designer needs to get a
hold of this um and i can make a couple
recommendations just from my experience
in design
one is that you need to break up that
hallway somehow
so either it's it's some kind of inset
um
and
my i'm running out of battery here on my
pointer
so
there there needs to be there needs to
be something
you know here or here or you know
somewhere that breaks up this
long corridor okay design 101.
the second is that um
the back of your house
because it's a shotgun we call a shotgun
design there's no public
or there's no family oriented space and
you're talking about sitting in your on
the back porch you're talking about
having activities where you can see and
engage with your backyard well you don't
want to always do that from the porch
because in the wintertime you want to be
able to see your backyard but the only
people that can do that are people that
are in this bedroom
so
you're not engaging with your the design
is not engaging with your backyard
um
this to me
uh
it reminds me of those like chautauqua
um
uh
villages you'll see them in different
parts of the country where they have
these
these uh bungalows or these cottages
okay and and
they're they're designed in a communal
environment and they all kind of
surround a big like concert building or
something
and you'll frequently see this because
the people aren't engaging with a
backyard or anything they're simply
staying there and then going to the
concert hall to the restaurant whatever
so but that's not what you have here you
have a real home that needs to engage
with the backyard
so
um those are two things the the the
other thing i would recommend is that if
you go
like ms boca was pointing out you know
this elevation
here this this side of your house
is is
you know
second
uh the second deadly
aspect of this why not
give your master bedroom more light by
doing you know a triple gang of french
doors or something that
you know
if you go to the elevation for a second
i can kind of describe and again i don't
want to design for them but i think this
is a good place to start for when you
have a discussion with your designer
because
the
so for instance here this looks like
your radon medication
yeah
but where does the audition actually
start beyond this right beyond the right
here
okay
so you have a door this is a french door
why not give your master bedroom
glass
this is the master bedroom right here
yes it is
so
where's the window oh i see this is a
window in the master bedroom right yes
right so let's open this up
i mean even if you have to move your
mitigation system just
open this up and that will break up all
the wall
surface
right so instead of it reading like one
long wall surface now we have
glass
that help that ends the wall surface
ends that siding material and now you
have this glass and then you have all
this light that comes into your lovely
master your new master bedroom and you
can do the same on the other side where
you have the other bedrooms
that's one easy way of breaking up a
long elevation of
solid material is by using windows and
french doors okay or sliders
or something like that now security
might be an issue i understand that but
if there's a way to do it that's going
to help in terms of massing but i think
your bigger issue is
you know have your designer really needs
to work out this long hallway and then
trying to get
you have a living room at the front that
you enter into and that corridor should
have some kind of node in the middle of
some kind that helps break up
you might even put a big skylight
above this node in the middle to make it
feel you know that it has light coming
into it this is a long dark corridor
um maybe put maybe put a
cupola or a skylight up there to let the
natural light into this
little vestibule space that would go
somewhere to the right of that you know
cursor and then at the end before you
get to the covered porch there's a
family room there's a there's a tv room
there's something else i mean i know
you're starting to i don't know what the
sizes these bedrooms are
um but i think you really i think you
really need if you're gonna make this
house livable you need to have this
connect to something here
okay with maybe a skylight or something
less natural light in and then connects
to something family oriented at the back
that you can engage and enjoy your
backyard
but i don't i don't really i i'm not i
can't vote for this based on what i'm
seeing here just
if you're looking for ideas now and it
comes back to us that'd be great
those are my comments
i i actually like the front porch
as long as it you know you work with ms
bokor on on keeping a really simple
elegant design to that porch
be great
you're skrusky get to change your house
so think about like
your windows i mean those are pretty
tiny little trays and let's say you
don't want to change them and maybe like
the existing portion but
you know think about what you really
want what that happens here in the
library needs to be if you want more
brighter you know
natural light is always a great thing
and
uh
just think about ways when you're
reaching that design then you can
and then what maybe isn't like something
great on the the original version
perhaps right
what would you really
right and you don't you can you can
still do it in a manner that's not gonna
go away from the budget but just think
about those things
as you're going through
or do you know for a fact if those
windows meet the egress requirements for
like a bedroom they don't i i could not
tell you so
that's one of them
you're gonna have to upgrade your
windows to if you're doing this big of a
renovation here bedroom windows have to
be egress windows so that's not
you're gonna they're gonna get bigger
anyways
sure oh you stole my thunder
mr uh anything else mr steele
i was gonna say something about egress i
mean
if if we're dating the whole design
would be
what's this minimum setback on
foot the best we need the variance
because he has five this is a 40 foot
lot yes so it's 6.66
and then he has 10 on the up one side
and five on the other so i mean that can
afford you a little bit of space if you
want to go out one direction
to kind of break up that some sort of
perpendicular gable and that master you
could have the the french doors
and skylights
facing south
and things like that too it changes your
roof mask now you don't have to be
absolutely
and i mean carrying that across the roof
line all the way across
it could add a little bit more to break
up but you really can't i mean if you're
getting a variance already perhaps you
can go out
is there a limit to a variance no i in
fact i would say that
the zoning board
while they're about zoning and we're
about design there's a lot of
sensitivity to
a different variance
providing a better architectural
solution
so
on the side where you have 10 feet
maybe you want to bump it out a little
bit or you know
give it some relief or
or
do something fun with the french doors
onto like a tiny little patio yeah
like a little niche or something where
like maybe there's an outdoor area just
for like you you know you guys to use
for like some coffee or something in the
morning i don't know like there's gotta
be a way like could you carve a niche
there
i would i would worry less about the
variances i'm not suggesting to go
one inch from the fence but you know
i i think that you have an unusual
lot that it's so thin that
there'd be a lot of i can't tell you
what they're going to say but i think
there'd be a lot more sim they'd be more
sympathetic to a variance to get the
massing broken up
they're very reasonable when it comes to
that kind of reasoning
and just make it be a much better house
general memphis neighborhoods
so have you measured from your
neighbor's survey to verify your five
foot that's where we got it from okay
this is very helpful because it also
showing that that house is
you know 16. 16 feet from your property
between our houses good that's great
yeah that that's actually not ours that
is the neighborhood that's why i was
looking at it oh i was going to say okay
i just found the lot numbers so yeah the
lot number ours is like 479. so you're
on the that's the left that's not that
oh
that's great
setbacks are different yeah very helpful
information yeah
okay do you want in anything else
can you go to the plan please sure
so love the idea of having dinner on
your back porch your dinner's going to
get cold yeah
right so
i i i think all the comments are
appropriate tonight about the length of
that hallway uh i was actually pretty
surprised when i first saw it i was like
okay
um that is that is a long haul you
definitely need to have a way to break
that up
uh i think
another recommendation regarding the
windows that was one of my main comments
that is you're going to need to have
code flat egress windows i believe those
don't don't so anywhere that you have an
existing window in a bedroom
you're going to be made to bring that up
to code compliance based on this type of
question question it
of course okay
um so
you said somebody referenced earlier the
size of the renovation so that means i
would have to put a pokemon egress
window in every
situation or just the ones that we are
every bedroom needs a second means of
vigorous so but the bedroom window is
required to have a window that you can
get out of it there's a specific 57
square inch opening i think it is
remember right that i know
um don't quote me on that i think that's
right so it's typically you know you're
looking at a
three by five windows one single home uh
it would get you there easily sure but
um the question says
everyone that is in the bedroom that we
aren't touching
or well so that's that's something that
would be building department but
typically sure typically when you see
renovation projects
if you're putting a porch on you don't
have to do all your windows but if you
find out you're putting doubling the
square footage of your home almost the
windows any new bedroom that's being
done you're gonna have to have that room
be co-compliant and if that's the case
you might as well upgrade the one
remaining window that's in your bedroom
number two again your header is probably
gonna be fine you're just gonna drop the
window down to a lower or level so it's
maybe not a huge cost impact you're not
restructuring those exterior walls
another recommendation just because i
have to is your master bath is on the
outside wall of your back of the house
so you're gonna have to double that wall
up so you don't freeze your pipe so
you're also bringing existing plumbing
from your existing one bathroom all the
way out to the back
please look at putting that master bath
next to the existing bathroom your cost
for tying in your plumbing will be a lot
less
i don't know where your spain sanitary
line's running don't know but tying
those together would be a lot easier
having them closer together and that may
then give you an opportunity to shift
your master bed into the back of the
house to have used to the back porch
backyard as well as maybe then changing
at the master bedroom entry maybe
modding widening the hallway there
skylight some sort of element there to
kind of break down that quarter a little
bit again really interested to see what
your designer does but those are
recommendations on just for like
cost savings items might help you a lot
plus you give you open your views to the
backyard
you know the exterior elevations i think
um
really hard to approve it as one long
simple box with a simple cable i think
the recommendations of of glass breaking
up the facade to help break the masking
down is a good idea but i think a simple
offset of a foot on the addition where
you breaks your roof line
uh changes the massing a little bit i
know we talked about the zoning
implications but i think that's
something that you could easily argue
will really go a long way you have the
opportunity to change materials you have
the opportunity to to kind of you know
really
change a little bit of the architecture
that kind of it's not just copying
exactly what's up in the front
and i also like the porch i think the
idea of that front porch is going to go
it's kept simple and
matches that you know the kind of
materials and simplicity of that i think
will go a long way
and i appreciate on the proposed
elevation that your off-center vent is
gone
that's all i have
will we see this again i mean we're
going to see this again i'm wondering if
maybe perhaps the applicant feels that
maybe he's not at a point where he's
ready to proceed to the zoning board so
maybe he might want to consider
tabling we can't make them table we had
that discussion today as well and then
you could re resubmit something with
better
um
i'm concerned about costs for a lot of
different ideas i heard although they're
wonderful ideas and i would implement
every single one with no issue if cost
was not prohibited
um
you might
might go to visa and see what they say
about the variants and what's been said
here um and then
but also be aware that if this does go
to be zap and they vote on it that
application is done if you want to do
something else you have to re submit a
totally new application well i mean i
would have to redo a lot anyway
if he goes moves on the visa and they
say they gave him approval for that it's
going to come back to us well it depends
how you word it
if you just
if we've had we i i believe we've
discussed this today like hit that it's
applicant's prerogative to ask for a
table
or
ask for a vote which means we you all
can
vote it
it
you can move to have it recommended to
visa but you can vote no
which it would still go there it just
would go with a negative recommendation
if you voted yes with a positive
recommendation with the condition that
it be remanded back here
what i'm afraid of i'm not trying to
sway anybody
what i'm hearing is a lot that needs to
be done
that will change
what bizap decides like i don't think
there's enough
to take it to be zap unless you
absolutely want to go for what you have
here knowing that this board will give
you
will probably vote no on a
recommendation for the plan as is i
agree does that make sense
but if he does it the other way and he
tables that he's not spending any more
time i mean the designer is spending
more time but
he's coming back next month which he
would have had he'd have to do anyway
even if we gave it a positive vote to go
to be zap so
then it has to go back
right
it wouldn't have to go back to be zap
there there's variance at play that's
that's that's my question
is
i hope i've heard they've been
very lenient i mean the five foot um
uh variance i mean it's it's 18 inches
they're gonna do what they're gonna do
but that's my question is okay
you know
i i want to know that these applications
before i do a bunch of different changes
or engage with a designer to make the
changes so i
i would ask your opinion if you're
speaking openly
about that idea i i you know well i
don't think that's what
we'll be upfront i don't think you're
going to get approval on the design
tonight right we're not sure
that's awesome
i think we'll be we'll happy to take a
vote on if what our recommendation to be
zap would be on the design i'm guessing
you're gonna get it we can move forward
but you'll get a no vote from the board
maybe
um
and then that will go to visa but
they'll see that we didn't approve the
design and they're going to be looking
at it solely based on the zoning
application
um your chances probably will be less
likely that they'll approve it but maybe
not because it's only 18 inches
i've already paid for the bzap
application as well well i understand
that but a lot of times their decision
is based upon the quality of of a design
that that that is in in front of them
okay but if they don't see the quality
they may not be as apt to
agree that
i mean it's up to you
let's make sure he's understood so if he
goes to b's app let's say he gets a note
tonight
but it goes to be zap and they say no
it's done
right right it's done yes but i don't
think with
yeah but i don't think we as staff would
approach it that way i mean i think we
would get make sure bzf has the same
option to say
like
we're going to table they can also table
it and just give you an indication of
their tolerance level for
the variance you're looking at
or that you want knowing that the design
is going to change
based on this hearing does that make
sense so like in my mind i'm trying to
think how we could get you in front of
b's app just to hear you know
just a
not a vote but like move it forward
without moving forward with the
remaining what their tolerance level is
my guess is it's going to be pretty
tolerant which then you'd feel more
comfortable paying a designer to do a
new design
does that make sense yes
i don't know if that's the way you want
to approach it but that's the way i see
it going so if i'm reading findings am i
adding all these conditions
of things to consider or no we're just
not making a recommendation i'm not
making a recommendation okay but
then it comes if it is approved the b's
up it comes back here
so i think that's the findings of fact
yeah
yes move to recommended b zap with the
remand back to arb for final
determination of a certificate of
appropriate so our vote tonight
it's going to go forward to be zap our
vote tonight is based on the current
design our vote tonight would be that we
would recommend that it go on to these
apps so you'd vote yes with the
condition that it be remanded back here
for final design review
these app could either approve it for
this footprint
and
that would still that doesn't hold you
guys to the design in the footprint or b
zap could table it which is my guess
what's going to happen say you know some
discussion that would i mean who knows
what would happen but my guess would be
that we'd have a discussion about the
tolerance level for such a narrow lot
in your situation and you're going to
give a report based on this meeting
absolutely yeah but our but but the but
the findings of fact needs to include
that we are recommending that this go to
to be zapp and that we asked and that it
be remanded back to the architecture
review board noting that the arb feels
this design is not ready at this stage
for any kind of approval
i think that's important
but i think you're going to again yeah i
mean i i think that's why you remain
something back right i think we should
say it in the findings so move to
recommended the b zap that a certificate
appropriate not be issued
um
but remanded back for final
determination for a certificate
appropriate before because that's what
we're here we would be giving a
certificate of approval
and just vote yesterday yes
noting noting that the ar beef
i guess
the design is not
it's not a is not ready is not at this
stage it's not reviewable
and so i'm just gonna be clear yes votes
sends it off with that condition correct
a no vote says no but needs to stay here
or it's not approved
no vote goes to be zap
with a no vote
but that includes the bear that includes
the variance
the no we're saying no i'll be clear
but we're voting
we're voting on architecture right we're
not voting on the variance
so
the applicant
is the one who gets to decide which vote
you want us to take do you want us to
vote exactly for the plan that you have
and if that's the case with no
conditions at all
my guess is
this board will send you to be zapp with
a recommendation of a no vote
or we can you can ask for the motion to
include
what we just talked about the remand
back here for final design so you go to
b zap you get their opinion
on it and they know that we want to see
it again they decide if they're going to
do that right
and then they probably will because
we've asked them to and then it comes
back here but then you have your
designer work on it
one step closer
yeah because they could also just table
it or they could say no
that's not we can
and then start the whole process over
but it would
obviously happen i was still working in
the same application but you're gonna
have to do some changes based on what
you've heard here yeah and what you'll
hear at the zoning board but but let me
assure everyone
that kathy and i report
you can you can agree with us
actually you can't you're not sworn in
um
we report we give a verbal report of
what happened so we're not making blind
guesses like i tell the whole story
about what happened at this board
so
it's not as kind of russian roulette as
it sounds to take a chance
and they're very respectful of this
boards
so how would you like to proceed i'm
going to ask you two questions would you
like us to vote on as the designers
submitted
no tonight would you like us to vote on
proceeding with that condition of
recommendation to be zen yes
can you please read the findings of fact
for the recommendation for this app
yes the findings of fact and decision of
the board for application number bzap-22
for property located at 2735 allegheny
avenue the architecture review board
moves to recommend to the board of
zoning and planning that a certificate
appropriateness
not be issued and it
and that it if if the board of zoning
and planning
tables
or approves that the final design be
remanded back to the architecture review
board
for final review and approval
board agree with that
do you understand these findings of fact
i do
can i have a motion please so moved
seconded
roll please
mr higher yes
ms kraske yes
mr steele yes get your man scott yes
thank you good luck good luck
thank you
okay i'll need that one too yeah i'm
still not working
you okay you want to pause while we get
pressured
okay
all right so
other business is solar panel revised
yes
yep
um under other business
can you please give us a report on the
solar panel revised proposed amendments
yes um um i am acting as the presenter
of the asked for you guys to vote on the
amendment ordinance which we have been
through
um both in this room individually and
then a couple workshops i think we just
reviewed it at the last public workshop
that we had and we seem to have gotten
to a very good point and we feel that
this
is ready for you all to vote to
recommend it
um
to be there they had asked for you guys
to look at it before they give their
recommendation to city council
um we can have discussion as much or
little as you want i think we have had a
lot of it
i would like to read the first three
lines of this sure
proposed amendment ordinance 14-22 by
matt klinger an ordinance to amend
section
1266.14 solar panels in order to provide
for consistent regulation in a
streamlined approval process for solar
panel projects
whereas city staff has been reviewing
the city solar panel code in light of
recommendations provided through the
city's climate action planning process
and whereas this proposal ordinance
provides for more streamlined approval
of solar panel installations while
simultaneously preserving preserving the
aesthetic controls
thank you
um
i also wanted to point out that based on
our conversation at our workshop
that um
in the 145 pages of design guidelines
that you may or may not have gotten to
over the weekend
um there is a revised solar panel
section so and it matches this perfectly
now
it does have a disclosure pending
amended ordinances but that now matches
this
my only criticism is
um
and i just don't remember seeing this
from our
retreat or
other discussions but 1266.14
b ground mounted solar panels in the
side yard
to not exceed 10 feet
that seems
uh
very visible to me
when side yard fences typically are
between three and six feet correct
so i don't i don't know where that's
going and i i could see homeowners being
upset with that um but it's you know
this is something that staff reviews
we're not going to be in charge of this
so
i just wanted to point that out i just
think that's uh that's pretty tall and
whether that's
referring to say though they're applied
on top of an arbor which is limited to
10 feet in height if it's a freestanding
structure that karen and i could sign
off on i mean it still would be subject
to
design review right so i mean if that
makes you feel any better that we would
kick that back to this board if there
was any concern it just says ground
mounted solar panels so i'm assuming
that means it's not on an arbor it's not
on a porch
on a roof of a porch it is its own thing
like those old
you know dishes that people put up hated
those and it's in a side yard or they
making that look like flowers i mean
they have some interesting designs it's
this is a staff review but i think for
the record i'd just like to say i think
that from a from a design point of view
that sounds i think we need more
clarification of what that really means
because it sounds like it may not be we
can
i would still recommend this to go to to
be zap uh it goes to be zap next right
yes and i think that i think it's
reasonable to approve it with with the
with noting that um
consideration be given to
um
what is it
1266.14
b
number two
did you get that
1266.14 b
two
um
the concern
of the ten feet height
be discussed by beats up
any other board comments
are we motioning this to move yes please
do i have a motion to prove and send to
these app with those conditions for
those comments so moved
second
um
all second
when you're ready we have the role
please
mr higher yes
ms krosky yep mr steele yes chairman
scott yes
thank you very much
i will now text ben
um our
final other business uh i think is going
to be also a presentation from
our architectural advisor the draft
design guidelines discussion
yes
i'm trying to decide whether i should
switch to just the indesign because i
updated as recently as all afternoon did
you put those other drawings in not yet
because those are going to take a little
more planning on the pages but i did put
in
amazing flow charts that can you give us
an over yes can you put it up on screen
you can put indesign up yeah i would
just let me just since we do have an
audience and we're on a record let's
have a look and there's an audience that
was participating there's still one more
flow i'm down to only 17 missing links
well i think if we give a little bit of
explanation even what this document is a
little bit of the history since we're on
record
and understanding that it's getting late
uh and then of course you could talk
about what we have here
be appropriate here and put it on share
for anybody who is
watching us at home it's really turned
out nice thank you
okay
um do you guys mind having the
guidelines and you don't care if it's
rough like this great
um i'll give a little introduction but
i'm gonna let bill do as much talking as
he wants to
as well
this document started as
well it's been going on for decades but
do what
you're giving me so much credit that i
can multitask
okay
we are remanding to the design
consultant fast display
make the graphics
better on the screen
that looks pretty good
that's pretty good oh thank you
um
so
this project has been going on for
decades i mean as long as i've been here
we've been we've been trying to update
the two-page literally typed because we
used typewriters um of design guidelines
when this all started um 25 probably
five years ago
um
luckily and thankfully we have some
amazing
residents
connie
is sitting there bill
all the people i can't go on and on
enough larry hellman who um
we
formed a historic preservation group
about two three years ago right before
covent hit three yeah yeah and
the
it gave kind of a it fused together
preservation and design guidelines which
ultimately then came out with the design
guidelines and standards document that
does have a lot of historic
um
context i'm gonna say involved in it so
um we have connie i'll send you a copy
of this we have not put this out on a
link publicly yet but everyone on the
board has seen it and b zap will as well
because we're just getting some first
feedback
but at this point we have
um a pretty substantial document i would
say
that
um
is
going to spend some time with our
members here getting comments in the
next two weeks i'm constantly updating
and inputting
today i think i've incorporated almost
all of your comments for example jocelyn
said to me in a note today because we're
using adobe creative suites to do
comments
um how about a section in the roof in
the roof of what the different kinds of
slates are i already have that on here
because i've been doing it perfect i you
know just
we're gonna do this in perpetuity throw
things at this and add it but this is a
point in time that we froze the process
i made it graphically so that it is
presentable and we are um going to have
it
i guess it's technically an approval
with
our recommendation to send this to city
council for their approval for us to
adopt these design guidelines
we want to frame that and phrase it in
the approval that we have the ability to
constantly upgrade and add it it's a
living document this is done for those
of you who don't aren't familiar with
adobe um
products the next step to this
i have been putting it into a pdf for
review but the next i'm talking about
process i'm gonna let bill talk about
design um the next step in this process
is to take it to bsap in the same way
we're doing this and then to put a link
out publicly once city council
gets it in front of them i don't know
how many readings it will take
i will work with sam our tech person and
in fact
yeah but i don't know if this is three
because i don't know if it's technically
and we'll talk about then ben will talk
about that um
we're going to put it live and have
you'll notice that the table of contents
has no page numbers they um they
you know you guys this is going to be an
electronic document so you click on a
roof in the table of contents it'll come
up on our website right and it's all
linked bill's firm has been
unbelievable we have
every
every drawing he's done
is in a linked file
i'm just kind of explaining how the
background of this works for those who
haven't done it and if if somebody says
oh wow that's the wrong kind of trim
he can change it and it'll automatically
change in here because it's all linked
so
i don't know how if you want me to just
kind of scroll through but the table of
contents is pretty exhaustive that came
from our meetings where we literally
spit out what we wanted to have this
believe it or not is narrowed down
um
so we have
some introductions some definitions
because as you saw tonight was a perfect
example we our residents don't know what
these things are mass scale
um
volume structure so we've done this and
then we've incorporated it into the
examples in the text and
we'll continue to do that um maybe add
some
um illustrations to this as well
i want to scroll down a little bit
further we have like processes and
pursuits it's important that you know
this is the kind of boring stuff that's
important what do all the boards do
what boards are i'm we didn't put all
the boards in bexley we put what's
pertinent to design
um
what's
this is the newest addition that you
haven't seen yet they're awesome
yep so we have
we have the no variance needed flow
chart
we have variance needed flow chart and
then we have planning projects and
there's one more
there is
for lot splits because there was a
change there okay so we have more but
you know these already just
linked him right in so jason suti had
done the original which i think you guys
saw was blurry and and he had um
somebody at his firm along with kathy's
guidance and help and partnership redo
our flow charts for us so these things
are like there's a thousand moving
pieces and parts but it just feels good
for it to be coming together um larry
hellman wrote
this um introduction to the history and
the architecture of the city of bexley
he was instrumental
in creating this neighborhood bexley
neighborhood maps which then the ohio's
firm took
and
really detailed it wrote beautiful i
mean we all i'm getting like just
compliment mr heyer
it's such a pleasure to listen to you
teach
our um
here and but to read all this was just
like a pleasure so um he
bill and his firm have done all the
little
section drawings
um we are going to be replacing
mayor kessler and i are going to do it
ourselves because we both know how to do
photography although
we're going to do nice we're going to do
really nice panoramics when fall comes
and the leaves change so these are
pretty much they're the right photos but
they um will be replaced with better
photos
um so
between between bill's firm doing all
the graphics and the write-ups and um
i've partnered with them to
do all the rest of it and try to make it
i i am open for any graphic um criticism
also
in terms of putting the pages together
it's tricky because everything's we want
to have some consistency
um a lot of board members gave me some
good you know advice on replacing
setting up i've set up parent pages etc
so
it's i think it's in really pretty good
shape we we will be able to shift it as
much or little as we need to but these
are fascinating reads so um
you know when you have the time take
time to read them and people are super
interested too
anyone who's seen this is just like
loves
reading this history stuff
okay
as much as you might like to take those
pictures in the fall you may not be able
to see what you need to see i know we're
so many trees we're we're going to wait
till the leaves fall
my favorite part about
all of this is that it puts a framework
around
what design means in bexley
so now you can define things by the
neighborhood
by the zoning by the setbacks by the
tree coverage
by the kind of garages
and it's all defined by districts
which larry hellman was essential in
helping us to understand where districts
end and where they start
and um we had a couple intense
you know discussions kind of nerdy about
where something ends and where something
else begins
but by the time we got through with it
to me it it really and karen was helpful
with this too we just we looked at it
and said
the names make sense people are going to
understand this
um they're going to take pride in the
district they live in they're going to
understand the architectural um
uniqueness of the district that they
live in whether it's a special character
zone which some districts have
like for instance if you go to
uh
the merkel
stoneworks district in north ardmore
that what we call the north ardmore
district
you know
that's a special thing or
south bexley has the you know the
euclair porches district which not all
the houses have porches but we're
calling the whole street
the euclid porch district and then you
have the tudors
which larry and i have been discovering
in south bexley actually extend almost
all the way to roosevelt now
so
it's kind of it's going to be eye
eye-opening i think for a lot of
residents to actually
see because when people you know when
when people in central actually drive
through south bexley they recognize the
zoning you know the the fabric the
closeness of the houses maybe the scale
the two bays and all that instead of
three bass
but what they're not looking for is
how you define some of those character
zones right and this does that it also
sets up um a lot of the details that
you'll see in different different care
different districts and character zones
and of course we were preferential on
certain houses
being exemplary for that particular
district
so
we had a lot of fun like you can
instantly recognize college avenue and
then over to the right you can see north
bexley uh
you know like up by the bellwoods or
even in parts of south bexley
and then central baxley clearly then you
have you know the mid-century house
that's over
i mean this isn't supposed to be the
house that's over
i won't say where it is but the idea
that it's it's exemplary of that
particular style which we have a few
examples there
so you
yeah and we actually have drawings for
the rules of modern architecture going
back to corbusier we have all of the
different variations on designs porches
additions
i for
appreciate the larger scale this is the
newer kind of ads that you've been
working on i think having the larger
full page yeah
and that that was fun for me because i
like doing doing that things that we
talk about here
about precedent and things to look at in
your neighborhood
this allows that document something for
us to point to well if and when you get
to the detail pages with karen was on
her way down to some of the detail pages
because our office spent
a lot of time setting up you know how to
understand a f what is a 5 bay versus a
3 bay
what's a hipped roof you know what are
how what's the asymmetrical 5 bait and
then we have all these examples of
chimneys
all these examples of
entryways um that to us we're exemplary
for what bexley's character is and it's
just a huge variety of stuff
but
you know we did have to weed out a lot
of stuff and say what is going to give
us the best
variety of slate
um because there's lots of different
slate i mean look at this guy in the
lower left i mean
you get these purple and yellow slates
on a house and then you have other ones
that are more like english cotswold and
than others that are the pennsylvania
i think residents just seeing these
pages are going to for the first time
they're going to see
how much diversity there is brickwork
look at all the fantastic brickwork in
bexley
yeah and this will be inspirational for
their own designs that's that's the
whole goal right is we want them to use
this as inspiration i love schmear for
all of their new designs
whether it's an edition
and hopefully you know by osmosis
they're going to see these details and
they're going to
they're going to go to their builder and
say uh no that doesn't or their
architect can say that doesn't look
right that doesn't look like backslide
hopefully they'll be able to teach them
and vice versa so then we get into
crowns and cornices and things that we
have really we really struggle with and
it's not just us everybody struggles
with this now because builders don't
know how to do it honestly
and a lot of architects don't know how
to do it um or they don't have the time
so here we did it for them
you know
there it is
and and i did take a lot of time in
reorganizing the pages and
spreading them out
i don't think anyone should get spooked
by 160 pages because when you press on
it and you're only wanting to see an eve
that's what i print off for and i'm
starting to do that already for
for
residents
um
i
i admit i underestimated how much i
would go back and forth to the
neighborhoods
in the context of helping people with
design details
um it is
awesome to have this document to pull up
i've been doing it already
um
you can see
boxed out
you can tell how it feels windows look
at now here here you here you know when
we talk about a six over one or a six
over six now everybody's gonna know what
we're talking about yeah
and modern windows you know with the
golden triangle or whatever you know
that they're all it's all there for
people to understand the terminology you
know shuttered what's a shutter dog well
those are those beautiful things that
actually held your shutters against the
building when it's open
yeah
exactly
so there's
i'm there's just tons and tons of
details in here i'm just going to keep
scrolling through
um
then this would have been this this is
you know what we worked on for so long
this stuff is invaluable to print out
for somebody like the garage we had
today
um
yeah yeah
nice so now we're getting into like a
lot more of the nitty-gritty of what i
use to help people get there but it's
kind of amazing
and these are still things that were on
our list
in our committee that we'll continue to
to develop
and add to it but i think we're at a
good point right now
this will never stop i'll get this to
city council and approved and
the
the intent of the document obviously is
to provide
one history of the neighborhoods and the
architectural styles within those
neighborhoods the appropriateness of
those details that are found within
those neighborhoods
um
and then
what i see is more standards based on
like garage sizes and zoning and part of
the the city code right
the intent of the design guidelines
isn't to say you have to do all your
eaves this way it's to follow a set of
guidelines to
implement when you're designing your
front porch chiefs right right something
for us to point to to direct yeah but
not say it has to be this even right
exactly right i mean i think the word is
important to know guide is the key but i
think that's awesome people get there's
a lot of cities that have
requirements right you know you have to
do it this week you have to have a water
table you have to have a family right
yeah that's not what the intent here is
we have we're but this is so great
that i see is it's one it's such a
document of what's here and what we have
the great things that we have
and why this board exists to try to
preserve those things
but then also how to do it because
you're right a lot of people lost the
artwork of how to build something like
this or to even design something yeah
well when you lose a language and you
can't speak it anymore it's gone you
know and
the goal is to gain it back this is just
i just wanted to point out the
solar because that'll be kind of
referred to in the ordinance
but i think it does have a reference to
design guidelines
so we went ahead and did photos of bad
stuff and good stuff
um but yeah i mean you're
first of all
i i
i don't get mushy or anything but
this document has been such a
such a
a work of love for so many people
like kathy and i have been working on
this for so long and i can't begin to
thank
bill and larry for all their work and
all of you for all the comments i mean
this is the ownership of this document
is this board
it's been interesting though how much
we've all learned about the city look
how long we've been here well i can tell
you that it's made us love it more it
really has
also when you understand the character
of actually by neighborhood by district
by character zone it just
you know when you have friends come over
like oh have you ever been to this area
up on merkel where there are all these
little stone cottages you got to go see
that it's it's just great for bexley
residents take more pride
so i wanted to also just talk for a
second about like what do we do with it
from here other than just use it
we're planning on doing um doing
presentations of this
i mean there have to be a time limit
we're not going to present the whole
document but introducing this to the
bexley board of realtors you know it's
really important that we get this out
there
um i wanted to also let you guys know if
anybody hasn't followed the is it the
actually historical society that have
put out those articles that larry
hellman's been writing
like the sears houses have you guys seen
that they're awesome
um i promised larry i'd somehow figure
out how to put a link into that to those
articles too why not and if it's just a
link
um
so there's all kinds of pieces and parts
that are working with this
as we go larry's thinking about a coffee
table book and a bus tour
the door's events bus tours
george bexley we have okay
yes i did that years and decades two
decades ago it's in kathy's office i
think we should get that
version of it it's mine yeah we do have
a door's a beckley poster
yes we do well there's there's a
playlist there's a bunch of
one or two that i follow from a long
time instagram
all they would do the most amazing
builders in bexley all over the world
yeah no we actually have one of those
doors of actually posters
so one other thing i'd like to point out
is that
there were two components to our
original discussion about design
guidelines one was residential the
second half was going to be civic
religious commercial
and so
being able to define in the same way you
know the quality
designs that we have in bexley that are
commercial civic and religious
is the next
it's it's part two so it's gonna be a
living growing document right
yeah and it should all be part of the
same
you know
area that people go to the nice thing is
is that a lot of the residential details
materials
are also applicable to a lot of our
commercial buildings so people will
start to see that right away
yeah
awesome
so do we have action for this so
i don't think we have action tonight i i
wanted to do
an introduction
see if there's just have a i wanted to
have a casual conversation
um
any questions any comments from anybody
um
and just say
i don't i mean this is not a board that
i have to urge i had 10 more comments
today keep sending comments
yeah
i mean larry larry's the best on my like
he'll catch my you know when you do this
many pages you can't catch your own
spelling errors because they don't have
spell checkers so
well it does but you'll see every box
when does this go
when will this go
and then over the next month or so we
have time for board
comment to you yeah on it from that
starting now i mean you guys all have
the link so keep sending the comments um
is that on any level
is the document being updated
oh yeah like today i like what's there
now is not what i'm pulling up here yeah
i'm sure if we went to that link again i
knew it would generate new stuff right
i'm gonna up well that's the only thing
there's a lag time on what you're
commenting on because we have to manage
the main document you know so
i'm gonna
every time i every time i save it as pdf
it'll upload the new one yeah yeah but
the goal is the goal is that it's
reviewed by arb
uh with comments and then bsap with
comments and then with the goal of
putting it before city council
in october that was what we had talked
about now right so we're on track for
that so we have three meetings in
council i think so i i have to double
check for this if it's an actual
like um an action or
i don't know i think there are yeah but
they're they're going to vote on it
being implemented
at arb right it's going to become
they're saying that we are giving
approval for it to be implemented at arb
to be our design the city of the
document yes official city documentary
yes that should be recommendation visa
exactly right and which time remember
it'd be great if we could have it done
by the end of the year oh i think we're
totally on track for that that's our
goal when we when we sat down with ben
at the end of the summer which is
whatever two weeks ago we made we were
like this this cannot go on anymore like
this is
we can add in perpetuity we'll word it
like that
um but we're on track for what we we
talked about
in october we should have
um an approval here or recommendation to
city council i'll i'll figure out how
we'll figure out how it's supposed to be
worded and by december it'll be ready
and then they have to go through three
readings i don't know i have to ask ben
about or is it just a recommendation get
that started because maybe i don't have
to have a public hearing or not yeah so
if they have to set that up
but i mean we heard like mr foster i
take that seriously that like he and amy
lower our house and like we should send
them a link and say oh i think that's
that's important to really people that
are actually working in the community
right yeah so we do need to talk about
that
exactly
because i know i would
have seen it so i think that's very
important and i'd like to be pretty
aggressive about it because we thought
we were being very open about the garage
code and we got a lot of
we got a lot of pushback that we didn't
put it out there when we did
but i want to make sure we really put
this out there right and and with every
code change i mean even staff finds
things it's like wow we didn't
rethink this
it's that domino effect
so yeah we should have like a list of
stakeholder groups
without going overboard that we want to
present this to
uh i would open it up for any public
comments if you want
since you're here
we'll have to swear you in since we're
still live no no no no she's not a case
public comment public comment it's just
a comment constance lewis 663 you clear
um
well i'm
on um i think this is a marvelous
document and just just going over these
you know as you're leafing through today
it just gives me a sense of pride
to be part of this wonderful city and
and for
the hours and hours that that you all
have put into it
it's just amazing and it can do nothing
but make the city better make the
residents of this city proud to be part
of the community and uh and to preserve
what we have here which is very special
and i would like to see those little
medallions that you can put on your
house in certain places
certain requirements that would kind of
be a cool thing you've heard me preach
about that one i know i know
but that's something that i would like
um
and
and just an fyi euclear avenue has we
counted them one hundred porches
just so you know
little seasons that don't
and they will after this
they'll put them on you know they
probably will they're getting copies of
this
yeah and so yes uh two weeks bezap
then october
you all do your determination and then
bzap does their determination goes to
city council i would think probably
somewhere in that vicinity
and then they'll probably i would i
would assume
that city council would like to have a
public hearing for all of the city
to have an opportunity to come and see
this brilliant document
and then
do whatever they have to do
to make it official
and i think that can be done by the end
of the year
so that's the plan congrats and
and thank you
thank you
i think this is outstanding i think one
thing that should be considered is that
this literally should be made into a
binder for some residents some residents
don't have online
and so if there's a book or it could be
put in a binder for someone which had to
be purchased or a donation made or
something that effect i think would be
wonderful because it even there would
like to be a coffee table book for some
people just to have it on hand to pick
up leaf through it would be great thank
you
thanks yeah make it available in the
library yeah we could make him feel
about the library and also i don't
underestimate i don't underestimate the
power of being able for staff to print
out a few pages that are you know
when somebody comes in for something
specific or their district or their
neighborhood um i did want to just say
that
bill and i
we did extensive research all over the
country and there is nothing like this
out there i mean we
we can't find anything like this
so
and all of because i come across a lot
of different design guidelines uh most
of them are
more civil engineering landscaping based
on city code and like setbacks and tree
lights scoops and those are some found
some amazing analysis
uh we've you know as an office have put
together some design guidelines for
cities here in town but it's much more
you know holistic views of like passing
and
things and scale nothing into this level
i i said that originally when i first
saw drafts
amazing i think that you're setting
you're setting the bar pretty high
and i think it'll be used once once it
gets out there it'll get used as an
example for other cities to start
developing
the format and it's been so much fun i
don't know if you feel like that though
yeah it's been pretty seamless and once
we once we all got on the same
platform
yeah
bill's
yeah
i was like no you got to change to us
because we're managing this and i bucked
up
a job any other final comments
[Music]
oh i should probably turn this off huh
so i'll tell you something interesting
i'm gonna brag a little bit