hello
hello hello
we are live we are being recorded
and we're going to call the june 16th
meeting of the bexley tree and public
gardens commission to order and call the
role
larry hillman susan quintin's here
sheila straub
here williams here dave wakeman
jim wilson linda
we have not only a corn but perfect
attendance but
the commission members i'd like to call
the alternates ellen bowden
here bob giller molly o'donnell
we also have perfect attendance by all
the alternates
and mayor kessler present thank you
and service director andy bayshore
welcome all we have a quorum we will not
need to appoint any alternates i would
remind the alternates that we encourage
discussion on matters that do not
require parliamentary vote
and we welcome anything you have to say
on those
on those subjects but for those that
require the vote
we ask that you join us
by being quiet sorry
it's just the rules of the law so i'm
looking for approval of the minutes of
may 19
2021 jordan did a fabulous job in these
considering she wasn't there and it was
a complicated meeting
i i have led them and jordan has
certainly taken a lot of time to make
sure they're correct i move their
approval
is their second second is there any
discussion
emotions made and seconded that we
approve the minutes of may 19th 2021 as
presented all those in favor say aye all
those opposed
motion carries any additions to our
agenda
okay now we're going to go to
announcements and small victories
and hopefully the mayor will be able to
pull up a couple
images we're going to do a little vamp
and let bob giller first talk about her
numbers for bexley and bloom if you have
them bob
actually in bloom as of last week
we had thank you had uh 13 i have 13 070
dollars we've raised
uh with 130 donors it's about what we
had last year at this time
we'll get more believe it or not toward
the end of the year
i did want to say that the our meeting
the bex of beautification
meeting was vigorous i would say i
thought we had a great meeting yeah and
everybody was there
really right the the o current word is
robust i think that's the word that
everybody's using so
was vigorous and robust yes and we thank
the city for their support and
attendance um
i was walking on clifton and saw this
great curb protection
that was the first time i had seen
something of that
nature and took a picture and thought
maybe we could just share this since
we've talked a lot about curve
protection
and it could might be attached to the
agenda
yes yes it's right there so if you look
they put looks like two by fours and
created a plank
and then have this um obviously portable
uh driveway that's the way it looks from
clifton
and i thought what a great way to save
the curb uh you know i was impressed
tonight
i'm sure that other builders have used
this
throughout bexley but it's the first
time i had seen it and then i wanted to
go on
mayor yeah if you're doing are you doing
okay can i can i say one other thing
about this
yes okay the the thing i really like
about this in addition is that the
gravel
is able to be contained to the site like
it's one of the issues we have with
these temporary curb cuts as gravel
comes out into the street so i think it
should be a detail that we adopt
or something like it okay
no they're not all they're plastic yeah
so so no and it's you know it's all sort
of tidy which is great i guess to your
point
and then i have a few more pictures of
the bexley bloomers at jeffrey mansion
this is the second level tier you'll see
the privet hedge was
um shaped up by yard barbers but the
bexley boomers did the edging of the
wall and the mulching and mulching
around all the private hedge on the
second tier
we have yes here is of course my husband
whom i had to feature because he's out
of town
and paul lacroix and
um there's plantings of perennials by
the little gazebo
area and one all and that's
planning some perennials on clifton and
i mean oh
and our stars linda sudden nick our
horticulturist and ellen bowden our
worker so
do it right right right yeah
we've had a lot of fun yeah so
are there any other announcements for
small victories
if not we'll go to review of landscape
applications
unfortunately elena was not able to be
with us today
so this will be like the good old days
when we you know soldiered on by
ourselves
we have a landscape application for
2699 east main street carroll family
dental
is dr carol here good please i think
that you should come to the podium if
you could
introduce yourself and
go ahead
and uh owner of the new of the building
correct
yes yes how are you so
there is um
i'd like to just just i want you to
start with the top and run through
so you'll see from the zoning um smell
at the very top just you know because of
doing it
okay don't i'm not worried
i'll just go and have another aha
all the
so dr kell there are five exhibits
starting with
with the information you gave for zoning
so
this you know current looks then future
looks
so
sure yeah so we are we are
now to the design for the landscape plan
that's coming before us
uh you and um would you like to talk
about the additions that you're going to
make on the landscape
plan yeah i can talk about it to the
best of my ability
i um i had a
i had a landscape designer
do the design and a hardscape to do the
design for the uh
the plants and a hardscape designer
design for the
um the new paver which
um i think the focus is on on the plants
today
and uh you know we kind of went through
a couple iterations of it with sort of
the look that
we were going for um quite frankly my my
wife
uh sort of uh led things and that but i
but i also really appreciate landscaping
myself
and uh but uh you know i think she we
went with
maybe uh i don't know what what the
genre would be
or the the type of landscaping you would
consider
but maybe a more formal look um
there's gonna be the engine heads are
gonna be lined by
a bunch of um oh they're uh the green
jam boxwoods
and those will kind of box in the beds
and um
we were gonna do like a variety of
perennials in there um
there were a couple types of hydrangeas
some anabel hydrangeas
i think there was there's at least one
oak leaf hydrangea
um you know and then there's some
variety in the front
and uh you know just just to try to make
it look
really nice um
just make it look really nice and go
with kind of the the new look that we're
doing for the building
we uh as far as the building yeah that
that will give you some idea of uh
kind of we're adding some new um we're
painting the building
both of the facade in the front and
the sides of the building the front that
brick will be white we change the
windows out
and then along the sides of the building
it's going to be more of like a gray
um and you know just just trying to make
it
it's it's it's a great building um it
was a great structure but
it really wasn't well cared for over the
last um
several years so uh i've
found that out the hard way uh in doing
renovations
but yeah and uh you know the goal is
just to make it look really nice and
you know keep keep it up and have it be
sort of consistent with um
you know sort of our our our
dental office service that we provide to
patients
okay you don't see it okay
all right so um do you want to go back
to just the listing of the plants mayor
okay so there's some listing of plants
you'll see that the
couple redbud trees are probably the
major addition as far as if we're
looking at
tree canopy and the rest are more i
would
suggest maybe in the ground plain cover
uh are there any questions for dr
carroll
one is there uh did the
sizes of the just for the
the application probably should list the
size of the material that is typical
the planet's problems that's part of the
application if we could go back to
elena's
staff comment she had no staff comments
on this other than
you know we might have a question about
irrigation so
if we go down a little bit maybe there
just to document i mean typically that
vision has what the plant sizes are
just simply it was it was brought up to
me by
by elena that you know the requests for
the sizes of the plants
but as we started to work through it her
and i
um that seemed to
be pushed to the wayside it could easily
just be a condition
okay whoever's done this for you say
look just list the sizes
yeah on this sheet here yeah
okay sure so dr carol i would like to
point out because
no irrigation is being planned for this
correct correct
okay they put a couple additional hose
bibs
on the um on the east side of the
building
um so that we can just regulate water
well so um i i think it's all always
helpful to know up front so that we
do um miss andrews does review
the bed after it is planted installed
and then we'll probably come back in a
year and any dead plant material would
need to be replaced so
sort of water as much as you can oh yeah
yes
and if uh when you buy plants if you get
your guarantee on them against that's
always helpful you know we don't want to
be mercenary but it really works out
better for everybody
sure if you can do that uh actually one
question as far as the
size of the plants i feel like um
that may to some extent be subject to
what is available
um is that is that something that i can
indicate
i i mean i guess my question would be um
can can i indicate that after purchasing
the plants for for instance meaning like
you know if they have like a number
three container or a number five
container of the hydrangeas
maybe they don't have five containers
but we want the five container
i would hate to say we're going to use a
number five container
and then go to say oaklanders3 and find
that they're completely out for the rest
of the year
we'll have to do a number three
container so is that something that
if if um if the size of the plan
is the condition of the approval then
that would probably end up as a staff
related uh discussion with you the
applicant and
andrews okay and so that would be
something that you know she would decide
what would work best for both parties
okay okay okay susan what is the corner
what is the street that's
can we go to go back it's maine and what
what is is this
what grandson brandon
is that our street tree uh the um
canadian red bud no
no it's a great tree street
yeah so that's kind of street on the
other side of that
grass lawn area so the
those red buds are planted where
is
it'll take some work do you have a
different suggestion
sheila's a red butt expert yeah
we yeah very excited about this project
this
building and the landscaping has been
falling out for the 45 years i've lived
here
for somebody to take it on so i think
it's wonderful
and and absolutely molly is correct um
we've had three red vlogs in our front
yard
you need to know the story but it was
struck by lightning and out of respect
we
had them all removed and i have three
great
red bugs
okay other questions for dr carroll or
other questions that might require
uh qualifications
i have another one molly i i just have
to
i'm not allowed to you aren't and ellen
is not here for you to share your
comments with right so i'm
no it's just one of those things as they
say
are there other questions for dr carroll
i think um elena had told me verbally
although
it's not in her incontinence that she
thought that the
additions the vegetation editions were
appropriate and that it would improve
the
building the site of the building and
the location and and
she did not find anything of concern
about any of them
thanks yeah she was able to give me some
guidance too there were certain areas
like in the
around the planter we had something else
and then she had made some
some helpful suggestions and then we
decided i forget what the name of them
is
but i think it may be what we're using
there may be using the medians in bexley
in certain places
but so i i had conversed with her on
it okay all right
any questions okay then
i will take a motion with conditions
without conditions
larry's here i would move the uh
approval
of detention upon plant sizes be
included in the
application is there a second second
is there any discussion a motion has
been made to approve the plan
on the condition that plant sizes be
included in the application all those in
favor say aye
aye all those opposed same sign okay
motion carries
okay thank you for coming today dr
cheryl
uh we set it for september 8th let's see
yeah that's what we hope for and i think
i mean you guys
when it comes to installation landscape
material if you delay
that a little bit so it's a later fall
install
have better success that's
that's good to know i think i think the
way it's looking
um it probably will be
a little later are you giving away some
free root canals
if you come and help me plants
yeah we will very well we will yes yes
yes thank you very much okay thank you
thank you very much
um and that and i actually i should
address that as you might remember the
the mayor and i agreed to help um matt
rayden on
vernon and um we're working on setting
up a time to do that yes
yes so that'll be so we should come in
july and tell you about that so thank
you dr carol
okay now we are going to go on to 424
south columbia um as you might remember
this
application actually was reviewed in two
parts
we had we tabled the approval of the
landscape
and then um the tree commission put
three conditions
uh that they wanted to see met um
i think i would say in anticipation of
reviewing the landscape plan
uh a second time i it took a little time
to review the
parliamentary procedure for applications
that are tabled or emotions that are
tabled
and the table notions need to be brought
forward at the next meeting
to get them off the table we need a
motion with a second
it's not a it's not a debatable topic
so there's no discussion on it and we
needed a majority vote
and if the motion's not taken off the
table this month then it's instead
it would start over again so i'm going
to suggest
that we start with um
the the
motion on tabling continuing to table
not table
or or killing the table motion
and then from the outcome of that we
will
or we will not look at the um
information that was forwarded
on the uh on the conditions that mr
wilson suggested
and that we approved correct
is there a second okay again there's no
discussion so
motion's been made and second did that
we take the landscape application for
424
off the table all those who say yes
say yes all those who say no
say no okay are there any abstentions
no so we have a hundred percent all
right
so that's off the table now let us go to
the responses to the questions that mr
wilson had
so let's see for those um
i don't know mayor if you can pull up
the minutes
because jordan did a great job
of noting the three different motions
that mr wilson and
mr wilson and miss williams made and the
first one was
uh jim wilson made a motion to prove
that the owner come to an agreement with
mr charlie hire
owner of 436 south korea regarding if
premiums or evergreens
are the best for the lower strategies
buyer's driveway
owner to enter into a written agreement
with mr heiler and all future property
owners
that allows driveway access to maintain
all plant material
let's see i can tell you there we are
there
okay if
[Music]
keep going there
right there right there okay that's
great okay
um that allows driveway access to
maintain our plant material with two
beds
ordered to guarantee that the landscape
plan will not change for 10 years
and all failing and or dead plant
material to replace per the original
landscape plan
so i believe elena received some
information back
mr wilson have you reviewed that i i
reviewed
what was in the attachments that ellen
has sent to the commission
and the agreement i saw wasn't what i
understood we
had asked the property owner to enter
into it was an agreement to in the
future
enter into an agreement to allow
property access and it doesn't say
anything about what conditions mr heyer
might have put on
access and and so i guess
my position is that that that condition
hadn't been fulfilled yet
okay and would you have a suggestion on
how that
condition could be fulfilled well i
thought i mean
i'm not their lawyer no i i would say i
would be satisfied if we actually saw
a written agreement signed by mr heyer
that set forth the conditions
that upon which the property owner could
enter what their obligations are
in terms of maintenance it's not for me
to suggest what mr o'hara no
no no i just wanted to make sure that we
knew that the
um letter should come from mr higher not
from mr shaw well i think it has to be
signed by both of them yes
because i think there are going to be
mutual obligations in it but i think
it needs to be signed and it actually
has to specify rather than
set forth the hope for future okay all
right are there
other portions of that suggestion that
commission members would like to comment
on
no okay and mr beard would you have
any information along that
number one item
let's go on to number two jim wilson
made a motion to prove that the owner
and landscape architect clarify
if an ornamental piece will be located
on the lower wall to share the
information with mr hire along mr hire
to comment on the design of the june 16
2021 meeting if desired
um so do we have information on that
[Music]
yes there is no ornamental piece being
proposed
there is i'm starting here there's none
there is no ornamental piece being
proposed on top of the wall
okay so
do tree commission members feel them
that
condition is null and void
i feel we've gotten our answer yeah okay
all right so um we'd like the minutes to
note
that the landscape architect has
signaled that there will be no
ornamental feature on top of the wall
okay number three celeste williams made
a motion to prove that the owner and
landscape architect provide drawings
elevation and renderings of the
retaining walls
and onto my offense surrounding the pool
deck with dimensions
i think that was part of the issue we
were not exactly sure
on sizes and dan did that come
forward yes it did okay
so that should be attached to this plan
so and are you ready to leave us through
that sure
okay yes i'm gonna i'm gonna get the
lights
mayor kessler no if you could if you
could go back to just the first page of
the plan
and then i'll just simply say next slide
please it will work totally fine
sounds great
i'm sorry the first action yeah the
[Music]
the main point um around this master
plan discussion last month was really
the pool deck the privacy hedge in the
walls
um on the southern edge of the shahs
directly directly north of mr ohio's
property so
that's really what i'd like to discuss
today next slide please
oh wait did you go all the way okay i
did okay
there we go you can see the outline
there that that really was the point of
contention last month
the front elevation shows all the needed
dimensions that were requested
um last month by the commission showing
the column heights the distances
the driveways and the gates along with
all the walls and gates on the southern
end as shown
here nothing in this elevation or design
has changed we were simply just
providing the
dimensions requested
some of the changes along the pool deck
um were for
clarification on uh the pool uh
protection enclosure
which we can see that it is completely
enclosed by the pool house
a series of ornamental fence walls and
gates that give you that 100 percent
protection
around the pool you can see on the
northern of the of the plan
here that we have the the
ornamental gate and wall and then on the
southern end of the plan here
the ornamental fence that connects the
retaining wall
with the front white brick
next slide please
another point that we wanted to bring up
was the uh landscape
choice and agreement um the the choice
we went with was a gold map
uh evergreen massing this campus
and it was specifically chosen by mr
heyer
along that wall we think that this would
pair well with a very simple
vinca ground plane underneath it
this will give us a little bit more
structure obviously in the winter months
with the evergreen coverage
so we moved away from the grasses that
were previously proposed
no this is fine looking at this
elevation you can sort of see where that
fence
makes up for um where the wall does not
so there's a small piece
that connects the retaining wall to the
front brick column
and it's the same thing on the northern
edge of the plan if you could
scroll to the right you can see that
that fence connects that lower wall
to the brick column in the back again
next slide please
some of the planting has taken place um
we wanted to show
uh some of the the softening of the
landscape obviously the
the buffering going in and we think that
it's it looks
very nice there's another image on the
next page too
if you wouldn't mind scrolling down that
shows that condition
of the retaining wall up against that
brick column the only fencing you will
see will be in that small little seven
foot
span the rest of the protection will be
held by the wall
looking at the western elevation
completing that that pool protection you
can see a series of
brick columns and walls along with gates
along that back
pool house edge there's a series of
evergreen hedges and ornamentals back
here that
tie themselves to the facade and leave a
nice open
um play lawn on the
on the northern side of the property
and i believe the last slide is just the
master plan again
so um before we ask
uh dan questions about this and discuss
it we have some guests here some
residents
from south columbia and
with the either the ratners like to
address the tree commission
of course of course okay
so um
what was trying to decide to put on the
lights do not put on lights
so uh let's go to questions let's go to
questions who has
who has questions for mr beer
yes sir yeah the last
yeah um the previous submission had all
the plant sizes and spacing and
everything this was just for
clarification on these
smaller items so i
i do know again i'm talking to elena
that she feels
that this landscape plan is a better and
more comprehensive landscape plan than
the first one that was submitted
and uh that that's what she said
i don't want to elaborate on that but
she felt comfortable with the plan
[Music]
yeah i have a question um when we talked
about the previous agreement about the
no
ornamental addition to be
added to that wall can that be part of
the agreement that
both people will put into the in other
words
since it's not now can it also be 10
years from now
that both people will agree nothing
added to that
i i don't see why we couldn't make a
motion to that
or or make it a condition of approval
right
okay other questions landscaping again
we're looking at the landscaping
and the wall we can talk about the
landscape for the entire property but
most of our focus has been on the
landscaping around the wall
and the pool yes jim dana this is
an unfair question to you but you're the
one here
um last month my recollection was we
didn't approve the landscaping plan we
tabled it but then the arborvitae when
it were
went ahead and were planted why was that
um i'm not sure i have it
i'm not sure i have an answer for that
at least a good one
i i think that's probably an honest
statement
and um i do not unless mayor do you know
if the shaw's fair on the zoom
and be able to answer that i can't tell
we have a call in so that would if
if uh if the colon is the shaw's
okay i'm not sure okay so it's not
identified
but they are able to unmute themselves
if they wanted to okay
so mr mr shaw if you were on and would
like to answer
that question by unmuting yourself we
would certainly
welcome and invite you into the
conversation
so are there other other other questions
for dan
i i don't have a question for dan and i
feel that he's been sort of put in the
middle
of the situation what i'm concerned
about is
going toward the future that we don't
run into the same problem again where
we're the purpose of our tree commission
and what we're called to do
is to approve uh landscape plans and if
a person
a homeowner decides that what we have
agreed upon with the homeowners and
follow through
that it lessens the validity and the
importance of what our city has given us
power to do
and so i'm very disappointed that this
has happened and i'm disappointed that
the owner last week who was online did
not
was not strong enough to speak up
for this and i would really like to
understand at what point
the communication broke down and
building
the the going against the plan that was
uh
agreed upon started to change who did
that
and why is it that the homeowner didn't
feel compelled to be responsible for it
and then kept on building a wall still
last time
so unfortunately we are not here to
address that communication or process
issue we are here to look at the wall
and the landscape but in in
um if we look at a new business we will
certainly talk about the way in which
we came to decisions last month and to
see if there are better ways
that we can do business and make
decisions so save your comments
for them okay thank you celeste anything
else mr whiteman were you gonna
mention something you just go over the
plant material again that you
that has been switched from the
ornamental grass and the catman
to now sure sure um mayor could you
just go back a couple of slides please
right here so we had originally um
the upright grasses and some catmint and
we switched to
um a small gold mop evergreen massing
along that entire edge along um with a
vinca ground cover
for that entire plane
is that a cypress the gold yes
cyprus yes okay sure
okay other questions we're going to
go building on celeste said even though
we can't deal with
the aspect of
the ugly house on colombia how what
repercussions can happen to homeowners
or
landscape people when they go ahead and
work without approval
i would say that that's not a question
that that we can
take under advisement right now we are
looking at the landscape plan
process process and penalties would
happen at a different time maybe under
different jurisdiction or different
court
we are looking at a landscape plan madam
chair if i guess there's a point of
order if
if the tree commission doesn't approve a
plan with our providing in it and
there's a different plan
specified then the property owner would
be compelled to remove any
any material they've installed they know
that that's at risk
so if i mean i i don't think that we
you would want to use it as a as a as a
penalty if you thought that arborvitae
was a
good plant material but it is certainly
within your purview
to say that that's not the right plan
for the specification and then
that would be a risk yes okay thank you
mayor
other comments
okay um miss rose do you have any
comments
[Music]
that will do something just to represent
what their idea may be
on risk but the understanding that if a
board that required to approve it
does not include that particular at
their own risk and they would have to
change it
so i thought that was what was happening
in this instance
but they were trying to get an example
of the look they were trying to achieve
but that was at their own risk
thank you thank you
[Music]
it is critical to have that four foot
wall around
the whole area
[Music]
right yes and i think you were
specific about that at our last meeting
as well so
thank you thank you okay larry
[Music]
and complicated i wasn't here for
the last year but i think this in
general
um this has been around for a long time
and the sooner this property gets
landscaped the senior degree material
gets to put in the sooner finish starts
to happen the sooner everybody
is going to be happy and i'm not saying
that to say well we better
move ahead with our provider here unless
there are some serious objections to the
archive
delaying this yet another moment to
search for another plant material
is that really in right fairness given
that we've had this raw construction
site for years
and in my mind it's time to kind of move
on unless we have some
really strenuous objection against that
material and the hold back
because uh with that really
there's a lot of that associated with
this application but for now
we face this issue and i guess for my
thinking uh the sooner we can get this
site completed
finished occupied it's in everyone's
best and first neighbors
so any other questions for mr beer
otherwise i'd
like to call mr ratner any questions for
other
questions for dan okay thank you dan
very much thank you
mr brother will you state your address
and your full name my name is alan
radner and
the property owner is my wife carol
radner
she's delegated me to speak
we live in 400 south columbia which is
two houses north of the involved
property
i spoke last time but i think there were
a couple members
who weren't here just just mr hellman as
a commission member
well my remarks
are not to hold up the landscaping plan
here uh we did not get notice of this
meeting i don't know if it was
we were supposed to be noticed but we
did not and we only had
a very short time to look at at the
plans
i did have one question actually too
one is that it was my memory and i'd
like to review the video
that there was a discussion and emotion
that the plan would be in effect for 10
years and if any
of the material died it would be
replaced
i thought that was in connection with
the entire landscaping
i could be wrong but i thought that
there
there was that discussion i remember the
discussion about the calipers
from the arborist here but i don't see
anything in that
and i also remember i had made a comment
that the
the tree commission had put in or
your prior iteration i don't know many
years ago
had put in a landscaping plan on my
neighbor to the south
and when all his trees died he just
never replaced him
so his lawn is barren there's no canopy
at all in fact there's no canopy now
between mr heyer's house and my house
in any event i think you need to look at
that and even maybe think about that
because that's going to be serious
issue in light of the streetscape
appearance of this house which we
are all familiar with in the
difficulties
of that as to the ornamental offense i
think that was something mr hyre was
promised
but apparently he was mistaken so he's
not going to get this
ornamental offense and i think i don't
know how much interest the tree
commission has in that one way or
another
and finally i i just noticed
that the pillars are over six feet i
don't know if that's
um higher than they should be or if
that's been approved by the staff
or if that's a big deal but it does
affect the appearance and i don't know
if that's your
bailiwick at all the second
issue i'd like to address was by the
member over here
what's the way forward um as i
attended the last meeting the
frustration of this committee was
palpable
even the landscape architect says you
know i gotta work with what i
got and mr hellman wasn't here but he
may have heard my
frank lloyd wright quote at the arb
that you know vines won't cover up bad
architecture and i think a way forward
here
for this committee and for the city
would be to seriously consider an
independent
investigation as to what happened in
this case carol and i
have attended every single meeting
for three and a half years in this case
we know exactly what failed
here in the system we know who was
improperly approached
we know that high ends were lost through
no fault
i don't think of the city new plans were
submitted that were not
the same we know that uh
we know all these things but we can't
tell you because you announced at the
beginning of the meeting
it's not proper discussion but i think
a normative organization a good
governmental body
when they see a mistake does an
investigation not include in the
congress united states
and decides what went wrong so that will
not
go wrong again in the future so i would
encourage
this body to make a recommendation to
the mayor
and to the city council to have an
independent exact
investigation of what went wrong in this
case
and learn from those mistakes
and i don't think there is one thing
that that got us to this point
this was a multi-layer multi-faceted
drop the ball by a lot of people
okay and i think that i would encourage
you in your general session
to consider that as a solution to this
very difficult
situation thank you thank you for coming
and thank you for sharing your passion
and
um as i said on our agenda we do have
a review of our decision-making um
actually we do that every december we
talk about what we could do better
how we could do it better who could do
it better and
this would be something that we talk
about today and i'm sure that we will
come back to it often
so we appreciate
you sharing your opinions and your
passion
so i will ask now
mr wilson we are we have like bifurcated
information here we have the information
we need
um to come as a joint agreement for mr
haier and mr shaw
and then we have the landscape plan um
are you thinking of
something sequential
oh i'm thinking a lot
i mean my basic problem is putting aside
the process and things we'll discuss
later in the meeting is that the person
that probably suffers the most from
delaying implementation of this
is mr heyer in the sense that he's
got an unlandscaped neighbor right next
to him
and others do as well and so
you know on principle what i would would
be inclined to do is have the the owners
come back to us with an appropriate
agreement
next month if they if they want this
approved
but that leaves mr heyer and others
disadvantaged but
on the other hand it encourages this
kind of behavior which i
you know i don't want to attribute
motives
but um i think if anyone had reviewed
our minutes they wouldn't have thought
the agreement that was presented to us
was what we asked for so
the other issue is is is also
you know if we delay much longer it's
already been hot enough
whether this landscaping can occur
before the fall
and so those are the concerns that
underlie
my meditation um here um
so why don't i try a motion and see if
it garners support
i would move that we approve the
landscape plan with the following
conditions
that the owners present
an agreement signed by mr heyer and
themselves
in accordance with the terms of our
motion at
our main meeting for to provide for
maintenance
of the property that the owners
guarantee personally that the landscape
will not change for 10 years
regardless of whether they continue
ownership of the property
and then any plant materials will be
replaced
as is for that 10-year period at their
expense
okay so is there a certain timeline that
this should be
done by uh i'm not moving that because i
think it's sort of beyond my confidence
to know whether it's too
late already to do it uh now whether
it's better off done in september or
or it can be done now if others
want to suggest a better motion i'm
happy to have that done okay well before
we discuss we need a second
am i allowed to ask no no you're not
i'm not allowed to question i have a
question after a second
yes you are i'm sorry okay is there any
discussion
all right the question
is if a if
the tree in public garden which makes uh
agrees to a plan
and there is something that is that does
not happen
because of that plan uh can the owner
still get an occupant
occupancy permit or what is the
and we agreed to this and the agreement
is made or attempted
but never put into place
or as it does not occur by some set
period of time
then can the owner be denied
based on our what what is what is the
penalty
for not adhering to uh
a approval of the land if there are
fees that are in our ordinances that
they can pay
if they're trying to seek an academy
there's certain items
on a checklist that are not complete so
they could be putting
cash up until that actually gets taken
care of
but we also give them time especially
when you're dealing with
like planting seasons when they're
having
strict allergies to make sure that these
plants do survive
but there's probably a panel with losses
which is probably when it was flying up
and not just being forgotten and then
more landscaping is done because
we've approved it however the agreement
doesn't happen
that is more easement agreement
yeah i just what's the downside to
stealing
partners on
the other side i mean i think we should
vote on this and it could be fine but
i'd like to know what the penalty is
if uh parts are done
i think i can answer that okay um we do
have a clause about occupancy
permits um but it's specific to removal
of mature vegetation
so it's specific to unauthorized removal
and the plan to mitigate that issue
so i think it's a little bit of a sticky
wicket because i think you would have to
based on our code you would have to
prove that the piece of the plan that
was not installed
was responsive to the under the
mitigation of removal of
mature material which might be the case
in this or not i think it needs a deeper
dive
to really answer that and so therefore
the penalty uh for not
meeting the conditions of the approval
um if it doesn't fall under the
occupancy permit the penalty would be
to um through mayor's court
to require them to install if they
haven't installed a plan
and if they don't and i
it's the agreement the agreement i think
that's
interesting what uh what holds
somebody's face to fire to get the
agreement done
they would be cited i mean the citation
ultimately
and then citation i just don't know
what what what happens citation and the
condition of the approval so uh
technically they don't have the approval
approval until they provide what's with
the conditions right
it's a zoning code violation ultimately
they can go to jail if you want i mean
i'm not really sure that that's really
no
seriously okay people have gone to jail
under zoning code issues through our
mayor's court
i don't know that that's relevant to a
zoning decision
in front of the tree commission but
there are penalties and we do
follow through with our code so
the zoning board who gave the approval
the condition of their approval was for
this board to provide approval so
technically which makes it a designing
code violation right
right i have another question
promotions on the table yes we if we
approve the agreement and it has
and can we also add on there that they
can't get an occupancy permit until they
finish
the job i do not believe so
how can they not get an occupancy permit
i mean if it is i thought that was part
of the approval process of us
to the zoning board to the occupancy
permit
in other words they can just throw money
at this you know if it's right five
seconds
ten thousand dollars and to shut
everybody up then yeah then
you are just left with another go around
and go around and go around
i think the question is do we have
adequate enforcement tools we do
i can't answer to you right you know i'm
i we
i play an attorney on television jim's a
real attorney but this is not the forum
for legal opinions
as to the remedies we have adequate
remedies
this particular section talks not just
about occupancy but
imprisonment for not more than 30 days
so if you guys are interested more than
30 days of imprisonment then you know
go to city council but until then yeah
you know we need to do our job
and then we need the city to do their
job and i think that we need to step
back and talk about what our job is
you know we have kathy and the mayor and
you know city council
and the legal bodies to interpret this
in the in the manner in which the code
allows
so let's let's let's get on with what we
can do
that's a long that interrupted the press
i forgot the exact motion
was there a time commitment as to when
the agreement was being put in the fight
no no there was not i'm happy to add one
okay okay can i just make a suggestion
when you talk about agreement i'm
wondering if looking at this agreement
obviously doesn't meet your language i'm
wondering if be more specific with an
easement because that would be the
agreement that would perpetuate beyond
the current owner like i said i'm i'm
reluctant
to advise mr heyer what he should ask
for but
i think mr heyer is granting an easement
but i think as a condition of that he
should require them to be in there
x number of times during the year to
actually maintain it sure but the legal
i guess the legal mechanism would be
something akin to an easement
i think it's an easement um with for
them to have access because that's the
only way it would run
with the land right for future owners
right so yeah
which clearly what they present is not
uh if that helps them
to have that conversation okay are there
other questions for
anybody about anything time
okay so the three points that jim made
in his motion
is a signed agreement by both parties
addressing
the language that is in the motion from
may
and then that the plants would not
change over a ten-year period
and that any dead plants would be
replaced as stated in the
original motion i think i said at the
expense of
the current owners regardless of whether
they continue to own the property
okay so is there any other discussion
are there any questions
are there any epiphanies emotions on the
table
okay so i'm going to call the
motion emotions made and seconded that
we approved the landscape plan
with the signed agreement between the
owners and mr hire that
over the course of 10 years the plants
would not change that
um that any dead plants would be
replaced by the current owners
and that i know i can't read what i have
and that anything that died would
be replanted with like plant material
at the current owner's expense at the
current owner's expense okay
all those in favor say aye aye all those
all those same sign in the abstentions
motion carries okay thank you very much
kathy thanks for coming dan thanks for
coming radders thanks for being
continuous involved observers
and participants in the processes
appreciate it
okay now we're going to go on are there
any other applications
okay then we're going to go on to the
mayor's report
and yeah
okay so
first off i have in my hands a dora cup
designated outdoor refreshment area this
is the first dora cup
in use uh put some sparkling water in it
did you like the sparkling water it was
really good it was pomegranate and
you want to borrow it uh-huh
but um so the dora i think goes live on
friday
two days from now and uh these are
compostable cups
and we're trying to figure out a good
mechanism for restaurants to be able to
collect them and actually compost them
but in the meantime
uh you can take them to your own
curbside compost receptacle and these
will be processed by our vendor so
even the stickers are composed well
international
uh shortage in printers of cups
so we had to get compostable stickers so
well i know this was not exactly an
arduous process but it did take some
attention and it seems you
all got it done in good order so
collaborative yeah
congratulations so those will be uh
starting off
rusty bucket brassica
um i think moshi sushi uh
giuseppe's cafe harvest pizza will be
our
our launching vendors for that so
for friday friday this friday
we're not letting the grass grow and
never feed on that
um we are uh if you haven't seen it
the fourth of july festivities are
moving ahead and uh
at full speed ahead a couple changes had
i talked about this the last the parade
route is a little longer i know it's not
a trade commission but i wanted you guys
to know
well they're going to be going under
trees so we uh we
exactly so the parade route is going a
little further south and becksley
if you're if you're participating in the
parade you'll have another block to
cover
uh so it's going down to astor for the
for the year and the reason for that is
we're just trying to like spread people
out just a little bit further on the
parade route
and then the evening activities this is
critical if you have not already secured
your tickets it is a ticketed event
free tickets backstage.org
and so far over 5800 people have already
gotten their tickets so
wow out of the total number of tickets
of
we extended to 10 000. okay we can we
can go a little higher it's it's
we thought you know whatever so we
probably should never have said how many
tickets there were but we didn't
so it was the system we started we're
now at ten thousand and uh
we think we could safely go larger than
that with the spacing
requirements there is going to be
separate areas beautiful
orange snow fencing literally
surrounding all of capitals campus so
is there a special section for the tree
commission there's a tree commission
section
it's under a tree find a tree that's it
okay
so you know armchair
guesses have ranged from 10 000 to 14
15 000. so we kind of used our we've
looked at that number we've
we've extended the the big parking lot
on pleasant ridge is going to be part of
the viewing area so we've made more room
for
people um that's you know there's not of
science behind the occupancy for the
outside so we're just kind of trying to
be
it's a combination of being responsible
that also ensuring that you know
not knowing what's going to happen when
there's no red white and boom we don't
know if we're going to see a huge influx
of people so
we're making sure that uh parents or
guardians are
present with minors and we're just being
responsible with our community event
um it is open to residents and
non-residents it has nothing to do with
residency it's just
making sure that you're registered and
that we can know how many people are
there
uh jazz in the park our second one is
this sunday
at 5 or 5 30 i think at havenwood park
so catch that we have a juneteenth
observation on saturday at capitals lawn
and we've also sort of related to this
and i think
we should take trees into account we're
working on a climate action plan
um which has a lot to do with green
energy and sustainability obviously
stuff we work on all the time but we
don't have an actual
plan with metrics and defined objectives
so we've started that process
through greenback sleep and you'll be
hearing more about that but you know
that
i'm sure there's stuff that you wanted
me to update people on that i forgot
about i knew it
i was like i don't think i said anything
i was supposed to say um
oh yes this is exciting so the bexley
beautification fund met
and they approved grant requests
including new trees in the right of way
of casting and you guys have spoken
about that
um that'll be the scarlet oaks behind
the sidewalk and the yet to be
determined ornamental tree between
sidewalk and curb
addition additional flowers and planters
going to livingston avenue
so we are putting flower boxes on
livingston avenue bridge
very soon very very soon that's about to
happen
and uh and uh planters uh will be
installed along the north side of the
sidewalk on livingston
a couple pods of uh of container
planters
what kind of pots are there the pots
that you're going to see
are throwback pots there are vintage
colorful pots from main street
yeah i'm glad you should ask that helen
thank you um
which i think are going to be lovely and
lively splash of color on livingston
avenue
so we're excited for that
yeah yeah for 30 seconds
don't get me started right now so
um a refresh of gateways at livingston
in college and cassidy and del mar so
taking some of the work that we've done
at broad and westland brought and
googled
and applying those concepts to college
and cassidy
um and gosh this is important thank you
thursday tomorrow
the livingston avenue study uh joint
living standard plan
workshop first public workshop is
tomorrow night on zoom
it is at six o'clock i believe right i
think so i just posted on facebook i
should know this um so that's via zoom i
said that
the link is at bexley.org livingston and
it'll be on our
site front page too i'm sure um
drexel avenue we had our we did have a
public workshop about drexel avenue
um roadway improvements uh
for next year's street project the
goal that we have is to calm traffic on
drexel and to beautify
drexel and so i think our traffic
engineers are looking at a couple
different options one that seemed to be
i i read from the group which was not
extensive jim wilson was
you know one of the major contributors i
think one of the options that
seemed really exciting was the idea of
medians on drexel
medians so a six or eight foot median on
drexel would be
would give similar spacing to what you
see today on
bryden or bexley park um so you can kind
of imagine
when i say spacing it would be a
slightly narrower median itself
but not much but it would be similar to
traveling
so if you get you'd get the feel of what
you wouldn't feel comfortable going 35
miles per hour in those streets
and so i think the goal i know the goal
is to get the speed down
naturally through infrastructure which
will then allow us to
legally lower the speed limit because of
the way it's a state route it requires
uh the merit of having slower natural
traffic in order to get the speed
down legally so that's being talked
about and i'm sure you guys will have
lots of opinions and discussions but
we're waiting to see the
findings from our traffic engineers
after that meeting
and the next step for that will be a
meeting follow-up meeting i think in
july
okay am i right do you know the date of
that annie
you know my only question be sometimes
when streets are redone
um the the digging harms the roots of
the current trees
if trees are being or streets are being
widened then you know the trees are
really at risk do we know
this would not widen the street okay do
we know andy i mean are they going to be
dealing
and digging down eight feet or at some
level that would endanger the roots of
the red maple sand drexel
okay that's the music to my ears thank
you
the water line work and the sewer and
then some curb replacement but for the
most part
it's not like it's restructuring of the
stream it'll be a
okay it'll be a grind and overlay on
this on the asphalt
um facade grants for
oh yes for landscape improvement so we
do have facade grants
for for exterior facades on main street
in fact dr carroll was here
from carroll dentistry his his outdoor
work it has been granted a facade grant
so that includes landscaping actually
but it also is front windows and some
other stuff
so um do you is it on the sliding scale
i mean or do you get five hundred
dollars straight or it it varies
it varies it's uh no more than ten
thousand dollars
which we don't generally give ten
thousand dollars
based upon availability funds council
traditionally has given
10 000 per year to the program and so
i've we get one or two applications a
year i usually
get a feel for who's out there applying
and and would normally kind of
say 5 000 is sort of the max just given
budgeting
and it's no more than 35 percent of the
cost of the project
today so if somebody came in and they
wanted to put arborvitae in
even maybe even before being approved
sorry it's an inside joke yes that would
be
and it was a 10 dollar project the grant
could cover thirty five hundred dollars
uh no more so i bring that up because
uh perhaps i did know that um the facade
grants covered landscape improvements
but i know we sometimes complain about
the landscapes on main street and i
think if the
property owners was probably different
than the people that are renting the
building knew that
maybe we could get some traction and
improvements
i mean i don't there how far this could
be taking but
um we know four or five
places where they could really use some
replacement and some upgrade
can we do matching grants in other words
you guys
i don't i don't think so because both
ellen and i were surprised by this
and she would probably be the natural
one to to reach out to
you know an people extension of the
program might be where
we can take some of the folks we know we
need some help whatever reason they're
not doing it
and say you know hey we'll do a matching
certain amount of fuel it triggered them
to actually make improvements
right mayor can you do you think that's
a priority or do you think there is a
you know
a sort of easy way to get that done yeah
okay
okay tomorrow no but like
no i think that these are the sorts of
programs that are
effective they're impactful they've made
a difference in bexley and i think
coming up with a new idea around it and
a new energy around something like that
would be great
so well i was just wondering if you
designed the program and okay
i mean you know maybe partner with the
chamber of commerce i mean they know all
these people too
you know i don't know because you know
we have a lot of
we don't have access sorry we don't have
access
apparently to a lot of the really old
landscape plans
and you know we can pick on this that we
just click on that's the pizza plus
where the fencing is falling down
and uh and the shrubs are all shot at
the pizza strip
and you know so you want to you want to
figure out what it takes to
do it without being you know a
regulatory hassle i wouldn't be
right but if we could do this kind of
encouragement kind of thing
where it gives me an incentive to think
about it maybe there's also the nudge
you know we're making some okay so and i
don't know if you guys know people
who have buildings on main street but
again i think you know sometimes word of
mouth is great
who who owns this so question how much
is there in the grant
in the pot right now so like this year
there's um four or five thousand left
but it's a council created program
so that the way that we would do it is
we would
probably add it would probably be a new
program the facade grant is is a little
bit more suited to
architectural improvements so i would
just suggest that we create a new
program okay
increase the amount of funding um to
allow for it to be specific
and targeted okay and you you'd i mean
susan had the idea of like
uh like uh i feel almost feel like a
reality show on netflix where
you bring in the landscape designer and
like they you know have a workshop
yeah yeah it's fabulous yeah you turn
around the truck moves out of the way
yeah there it is well we were talking
about the old concept these are so old
neighborhood design assistance centers
where you used to go in and say i've got
a storefront i need some help and they
help you and and then you take it
somewhere else
and you know maybe get some money to to
do that it was this program in the city
of columbus
i don't know 30 years ago but but again
what if we had a landscape architect
available for the day to give somebody
ideas
so all right so noodle about that
program
let's put some language around that and
i think that concludes the mayor's
report does it not mayor
i'm good yeah no
no so ellen is not here to talk about
the ohio savings bank and sign
maintenance agreement i don't know if
you wanted to add anything on that
that's been kind of a hanging chat about
you know getting that to come full
circle
so that they have agreed to
maintain and water the plants and to
replace any dead
plant material and i've watched
it seems like they are keeping their
gator bags watered so
so so that we can take that off the
watch list i believe so okay
unless plant material dies at which
point in time then
they'll get a knock on their door okay
hopefully
who takes care is that is that code
is that code enforcement yes enforcement
right with the debt right
right it's code enforcement but elena is
assisting with inspections right
okay and that's been helpful and
powerful she said now she's
you know people don't like her anymore
so she knows she's being effective
oh and to that point can i really
quickly address so elena
has been given a city email address so
that it feels a little more formal when
she's providing feedback on those
and our often planned but not executed
seasonal code enforcement officer is in
place
in his second week and who is he related
to on the
commitment o'donnell he's trying to fill
in the blanks
he's been um humoring all of us with his
stories and quips at city hall yeah he
is good at that
plus he knows his trees right molly he
he said dick knows his trees
he knows plants so i know he was working
the alleys today so that's good
yeah um and we have a new code
enforcement vehicle i think it's
actually plugged in over there the white
the white chevy bolt is a used electric
car
that is replacing the rested out chevy
blazer so
good good work good work well if if
mr o'donnell sees anything plant
material wise that he feels
the truth commission should be aware of
we'd love to have him as a guest
july september just keep it just
you know if you have to humor him some
night just make an offer
okay drexel pocket park ellen has sent
something did you get that
mayor yes okay
so i'm going to review this mayor and i
are going to review this together
because there have been a few changes
since we approved the vegetation this
pocket park
and let's get the lights turned off
and it has mostly boots to do with
hardscape
uh very blank and sid and his wife
denise blanc
um have funded the bexar community
foundation and after her untimely death
a year and a half ago barry came up with
the idea of taking
the pocket park and renaming it at the
dgb
kindness park in memory of
denise and then helping support
improvements to the area
at one time there was going to be a
water feature on the drexel
wall and now that has been changed
slightly to be less artistic
and more interactive so you see that
little round
circle there that is going to be a
rock looking water feature and then
this will be a heart speak here that'll
this will be a seat bench
over here and then is there anything
below that
yeah okay okay
right and then yeah and here's the water
yeah the mega kindness rock
the mothership i think it's 400 pounds
so it can't be easily moved although we
know that
that still could be a liability and then
on the wall of the drexel
um yeah right here actually rocks
someone has the license plate something
like that but
the wall would have a large slate board
and chalk would be available and
kindness rocks to be painted in some
sort of container
over here so that'd be a place to come
have the kids run around
create a little havoc and then leave so
uh as eleanor said the park right now is
adorable but it doesn't have a purpose
it's a great place for smoking but other
than that it doesn't have a purpose and
this would be a you know a really fun
fun outing go down there and hang out
for 20 minutes and have a good time
[Music]
we'll just keep you in the loop on
question on that yeah yeah
that's all right well sorry yeah
great stuff but you know from a
fundraising question
you guys would know this better than i
um
first how will this be named in what way
and does that raise any issues as to
what thresholds of giving
own what pieces of real estate
in terms of being now i understand with
the initials that
kind of causes that and i don't say it
because this is wonderful
right of course it does raise the issue
how many memorial spaces are out there
that people say well i want to do one of
those too and i'm willing to do x
are there any thresholds or any uh
you know any rules that we have about
how we deal with that so
um yeah i think that's a great ques i
think that's a great question
i don't have a great answer two thousand
dollars per square foot
yeah and uh we talked about
the the kindness park being etched on
the slate
kind of in the sort of subtly did we
talk about that yes
yes we did here or not yes for sure yeah
up on the slate and then
having some sort of threshold kind of
sand blasted obviously to the chalkboard
to sort of recognize it but nothing
nothing in neon no i mean i think that's
that's a question
that um we as a city
should probably address uh and we have
noticed that
the bexley bloomers have noticed that at
jeffrey because of course you come
across some ground and then you see some
plaque
that doesn't bear much relation to the
current circumstances
um and so i'm going to just segue a
little bit we're looking at an area that
needs to be tended
yesterday and it is a mess
and we're digging kind of through the
liriope in the weeds and it says
golden award winner girl scouts 2011 and
i thought if they could see this now
they might move down to just silver
level or bronze level
so again how long how long do those kind
of
annotations last i mean that's a good
question i think we should put it on the
list
until it gets resolved to dealt with
the subtler the recognition right
i think that's good
yeah yes yes yes as soon as we're done
with the landscape applications molly
barb and ellen yes
it yes really tight because you know and
certainly when somebody gives a bench or
does something or even a building how
long does that last
did they get it forever or can you
resell
the building
yeah i mean the fundraising world has
transitioned to
putting length of time on on those kind
of named
anything named artifacts right yeah
um where are they at on that
no but i did want to talk about
ex-officio and
and can we i think we should do that
later okay
okay okay so andy hey sure welcome
i know that you've just had such an
exciting meeting so far you probably
want to just come
push grant aside and come at every
meeting right yeah i knew it okay
okay what's on your agenda uh
thank you i know some of my homework
susan was
um he had to plant uh planting the
plants and installation for
spring 2021 i did talk to grant
um everything has been planted on broad
other than the islands
and the other areas he's working on it
and he's trying to source the plant
material right now
he'll be back in town next week so i
imagine he'll work on that then
i know there's been we talked about the
hardscape areas and entrances into the
city
currently we just don't have the time
and staff to do it so i do have a
contractor working on a quote
and grant will have that for the next
meeting for july great
that's good you know um as all of you
know we keep coming back to the
condition of our hardscape a lot of it
was
installed 20 years ago with the salt on
the pillars
and on the walls like at drexel circle
it you know
it shows his age so thanks
for finding someone to do that and we'll
certainly be interested in the report
and do you have anything else you want
to talk about
i don't know if this would be i should
talk to the mayor first but we are
working on um a quote with a contractor
to
do some of the work around i-70 and
livingston the on and off-ramps
entrances and nexus out of the city we
are working on that right now right
yeah i saw it today it's getting be
knee-high by the fourth of july right
yeah yeah and beyond right okay while
we're
we've had a couple speaking instances
where again on private pro well not a
private property actually
where we've had layered stem walls of
some height we're now seeing figures on
some of those walls
and i don't know from uh and some of
them would prepare death one on
part two and broad you know that that
though you're still there
well that was a failure that was um
engineered by a car
right but then there's a couple others
where they're bulging out right starting
they're
they're going further east and inside
mulching out and yeah a lot of them are
just dry-loaded stones
yes and so you know i i always worry
they're going to fall over and
you know hurt somebody or whatnot maybe
not but just
one more thing if we have somebody
that's out looking at landscaping
that might be one other safety thing to
kind of add to the list because
just give molly address yeah
yeah yeah so so larry you're thinking of
that as a hardscape assessment
not a code enforcement he's busy you're
thinking that as a
are you thinking of that as a hardscape
assessment
i mean it's a private property so i
think code enforcement maybe to the
mayor's point
i some of these i suspect are actually
on public right away
installed privately okay still
enforceable
okay okay yeah okay all right
anything else for andy okay
so i told andy that i was sitting in my
dining room yesterday and i see someone
from the city get out and of course i
think that they're gonna look at my
failing tree
but they have this spray can and they're
painting a little strip on the front of
all the
sewer covers so i said what is that
because i saw one on i-670 today and he
says well i didn't know anything about
i-670 but to
that point can you share with everybody
what it is
sure our water and uh our water sewer
department are working on
um marking and cataloging
all our main holes in easements and on
the streets we're
going to eventually have everything on a
gis map of our system
so when you see the color then you'll
know
i thought maybe it was we'd move from
blue to
green for something else so thank you
andy for coming today i appreciate it
okay old business we have a few things
that all go together
um we need to come up with a plan for
rolling out the tree canopy assessment
study
rolling out what about councilman sharp
councilman sharp on on here it says city
council liaison
well okay i'm i'm sorry councilman short
because i have you
under new business and you know
sometimes
you know these you know these things
happen and i don't want you to take
any kind of umbrage at it we welcome you
and we're glad you're here
and would you have something you'd like
to share with
i us on behalf of the tree commission i
did call
the service department so that they
could water the
new trees that were starting the world
in front of
non-creators well thank you so you've
been deputized
good thank you thank you
and gator bags on them yeah yeah that's
great
um so thank you for being here today
and if something okay and something
comes to mind
you can jump right back in okay so
rolling out the tree canopy assessment
study rolling out a
bexley landmark tree program takeaways
from the district of columbia tree
canopy ordinances
reviewing other cities rules and
regulations
filling the holes in our old own
ordinances those all sort of go together
i emailed you something mayor like at
three o'clock
three o'clock you probably have 150
emails since then
you do you need a new email address
just for tree commission but um jim has
jim had sent it to me
but jim had sent something to me
for jordan to post and she wasn't
available okay
he's got a spreadsheet right it's a
spreadsheet this is you gotta worry that
right i want to read that
okay we made can you go higher
all right so to the point to the point
of
you know what can we what can we learn
from others
um i'll let jim take it from here but
this is some of the information that was
in the tree canopy study
and so um you know jim has an idea
about what we can learn from other
cities so jim take it away
right so um you may remember one of the
questions i
think maybe it was larry raised when we
had the presentation on the tree canopy
study is
how are other cities around the country
doing and how do we compare
with them and this was a spreadsheet
that we got after
our meeting in april april and
in talking to susan about how we sort of
in a
logical way look at what might be
missing
in our own ordinances it seemed to me
that a logical approach is to
look at this list and see what cities
might be somewhat
like ours and then i'm more than happy
although if
others want to volunteer to do it with
me to then look at what they've gotten
their ordinances and see if they've got
ideas that might be
adapted to our own otherwise we're just
you know there's literally thousands of
municipalities in the us and we just be
sort of shooting blind
who might be doing it well so my
suggestion to susan was that
if there were a few members of the
commission that might be
willing to take a look at the list with
me
and identify either because you know
that
town city or because you're willing to
go on google and look them up and see
what they are like
then we could narrow it and and and
actually research what they're doing
both in terms of ordinances but also
they may be doing
you know positive programs that aren't
legal requirements but encourage people
to
expand the canopy so um
that in a nutshell is what i would
suggest in terms of
how we use the canopy study to
develop further ideas about expanding
our own canopy
on the facade budget like yeah yeah
that's right so you know these kind of
programs are too hard to talk about in a
public forum like this so jim and i
talked about
forming a small study group that would
look at this you know maybe get together
a couple hours every month
and report back and try and win this
down a little bit so
jim has volunteered to serve on this i
volunteered to serve on this
and of course you could serve on this
and not even be a member of the tree
commission just be
you know passionate about understanding
of the role of the urban tree canopy and
climate control and the urban
environment
[Laughter]
that was our goal today i think one of
the things
i think one of the big first steps is to
get
uh apples separated from oranges and
everything else because
um some of these places will have
pre-ordinances but
what they're really trying to do is
preserve woodlawns there's no
development right
you know and so i i think looking at
those portions
what would be interesting uh because
like you take a shark for example
well the whole charlotte thing that
doesn't compare
but charlotte has first-ring suburbs
just like we have
i columbus has performed something
whatever and if they can come back out
and say show us
your first spring suburbs in charlotte
what's there right
you can start to get some comparisons
and you'll see that there
how about charlottesville virginia
they've been around a long time they're
probably first during summer
charlottesville virginia yeah
so does anybody else want to serve on
this
you would she'll you will okay okay
i wonder if mr o'donnell would would
that be in his job description
maybe
okay we need to be writing we need to be
sending you
yeah right okay okay okay letters grumpy
letters okay
okay so all right well that's that's
great and mayor if there are
people that love trees that you know
aren't on tree commission are
knowledgeable about trees that'd be
also wonderful happy to have them i i
did want to say that i didn't know the
position of writing people
grumpy letters was available when i
volunteered to do this
like a separate like email group so the
information can flow back and forth that
we can actually work on this
uh in person but as well um
yeah i think that would be really
helpful to have i'll set up an email
chain i'll consult with the mayor
whether we have to keep
those emails as public record
having been lectured on that in my other
capacity in the city
well well we have four commission
members which makes the majority
so that probably would be for sunshine
we'll i'll
create it i'll tell you what you have to
do with your emails and then
we'll we'll make sure everyone has a
heart electronic copy of this
and then we'll decide whether we want to
meet by zoom or meet in person and then
talk it through okay
yes okay okay and i think maybe i'll
reach out to
um jason hollowell at uh
capital as well yeah yeah he was really
interested
yeah he says okay so then anything under
elsinore old business
okay let's go into new business so as we
said you know i
i i think we do a incredible job of
looking at our
our meetings and our discussions and our
behavior and seeing if we can improve
and last and may we had five
applications
and um i just thought maybe
because that was a little bit tense and
not really cantankerous but
challenging that if anybody had any
ideas of
improving the discussion or
improving the outcomes that we could
talk about it now
i mean i i can say from hearing the
discussions and
many of you have been around longer than
i have on boards that
that are decision making groups that it
seems that there's a
time when you first start the discussion
where you have to share your emotional
feelings about the project it's sort of
like you know this is what we have
before
and those have to come before we can
really address
you know what's being presented to us
and then get to emotion
you know i always think that
the discussion has to lead to emotion
because that's our job
you know so we can approve not approve
table
or approve with conditions and i think
we've made use of all of those tools
in the last two months but i'd certainly
be open
to ways that i could handle the
information and
the explanations better or that
i mean in retrospect 424
is a one-off because now
landscape plans have to be approved in
parallel
with the actual architectural review
process
so you you would probably not have this
huge gap where
all these mistakes and gothals and and
this didn't happen and that didn't
happen
and therefore the landscape plan being
way out here
really bears the heat of all that
problems that's been built up i mean
so i i'm not sure we'll have a lot of
that kind of defense
coming together we have that kind of
painful controversy or
it just simply won't happen again
because whatever
we can solve that were the issues with
that problem
so does everybody feel they got
information just yeah
let's hold on the information they
needed to make decisions
you know i know one of the one of the
thoughts we've had is that you can't see
these applications on your
your laptop or on your phone and to come
in
here and look at them the mayor has said
or ellen has told me on zoom
the landscape plans are hardly
recognizable that they just
fade because of i guess some quality
about the screens
and so so if you're looking at these at
home
and not here you really are at a
disadvantage
so when somebody submits a landscape
plan and personally i think
with you know the one on south columbia
the landscaping is trying to cover up
the mistakes that were made
and you know in the construction of the
thing itself the wall
et cetera et cetera but
it seems like um what is our the purpose
i mean you have to have a landscape plan
we don't want them to plant honeysuckle
but do we really care if they plan
our writing versus some other you know
appropriate you see what i mean
right across the front and i said i have
across the front you have those little
blueberries and they walk in your house
and they're just
it's you know it's terrible
but you know what i mean how much can we
tell a person well i think i think you
should you know we share our wisdom and
you know to point that it becomes
important enough that it becomes a
condition
or that it's a choice that they make i
mean
i i think knowing the plant material
and the caliper size
quantity i mean i think some of those
are some of the most important things
that we can
i can't do like i really don't care if
they plant
this type of box over that type of vodka
[Music]
and i i hope i hope i'm not fooling
myself but i think we've
done a better job moving away from that
of
saying you know arborvitae versus
camisiprus or whatever it is
or boxwood versus holly um
i think having elena here and then just
maturing in that decision making has
taken us to have a broader view uh jim
i i agree with with that i mean i think
we've
been less inclined to substitute our
personal aesthetic judgments for the
property owners than at least when i
first
joined the commission and i think that's
part of how the ordinances have changed
and the process has changed
but i didn't want to make sure i
understood what larry was
saying about um
what we experienced with the this last
application not
being a problem again i mean
so if i'm understanding correctly under
the current
new build ordinance they can't begin
construction until they have a landscape
plan as well as approval of the other
boards that are necessary
right that's correct but in addition
the landscape plan isn't uh
it has to be up front and be
part of the total submittal uh plans
right
because what we've had is a decoupling
of those so
because the landscaping is so far
after construction you know the whole
construction approval process
that has been segmented away from right
so we
we deal from our sexual abuse standpoint
or if there are any variances
but then six months eight months nine
months ten months later
you're finally seeing a landscape plan
yeah well and i and i
brought more and more so i guess my
question is
is that true when we get into a
situation
like this and i hope that this is not a
frequent situation but i do think it's
not
it's happened more than once in bexley
where the original architectural plan
is deviated from
is a hold put on the construction not
only until
arb or whomever has to approve new
architectural plans
but before the changes to the
landscape plan or proof because here
that's not what happened
they went ahead and did a bunch of
construction after they got
the approval from i don't know if it was
arb
or the the estonian appeals board i get
mixed up there
but we were presented with this plan
after
for the landscaping and they had already
built this pool deck
i mean so we had no opportunity to go
back to
the other boards and say wait a minute
why aren't you requiring them to put
this pool at ground level
and create steps from your house instead
of having this
barrier to their neighbors um that's
what that's what my problem in this
process
has been and if the answer is that's not
your role you just got to deal with
whatever sent you
that's fine but that doesn't really seem
like good
planning for the city it seems yeah
this that case and i i don't know
whether we're
how free we should be or can be or need
to be
regarding that but you know that that
whole project
was uh what do i say uh
it was all i mean all kinds of things
happen
you you imagine it happened
and the residents have a right to be
upset
uh because that project
exceeded and and but you know i guess
at the end of the day what is the remedy
with some of that i mean
you know the big issue everyone was
about the height
the height was was three foot whatever
higher
take the roof off their house down what
what do you end up doing what's the
retribution
and some of that behavior uh continued
some of it was out
without the owner's full knowledge i was
probably with the arts boy
but what do you do with that but what i
would have done had i been on that board
and said no
no cool no cool
you're not gonna build a pool with a
four foot wall on top
of six feet or whatever it is that's
what i would have said
and there are some things that my humble
opinion that we need to clarify
as to who whose pot some of these things
fall in
uh fencing walls are wall stencils
well fencing goes you know and then who
deals with fences
do we deal with fences sometimes but
oftentimes there are no yes but if
they're
stone walls apparently not so that's
that is not
completely clear all the time um
likewise
what standards do we have about how tall
a pool should be
are there such a standards probably not
so we're then left with okay uh
there might have been a reason for the
pool to be that height but
others would look at it one way and
others another so then are we grounded
in the code
to be able to say well we're not proving
that well why
or why so which brings me to another
issue
and there has been uh
i think there has been over the last
couple of years
uh i'll certainly say this for arb
things have gotten more legal and
they've probably gotten tighter
uh because there were parts and times
where personal opinion would take this
one
and that's happened with this this board
and in other words about style
well i don't really like that so that's
what's not up to us to decide
there are certain rules about uh
geometry and health and mass saying and
there's other kinds of things
that come to play and for example area
you can't deal with color
because color is a preference and that's
not something that you say
and so when it gets to this board
what might be an equivalent well we're
talking about screening
and what's appropriate screening
material not whether we like arborvitae
uh or some other you know so we have to
be thoughtful about the kinds of things
that we're really looking at
now the other thing that i'll shut up
the the arb
also has now gotten a situation which i
think makes some sense
to where someone will say well you know
listen to that you know that
and then they then what is asked by the
chair of the
member are you making that as a
condition
or a recommendation so as a
recommendation it might you know hey you
think it's a good idea to know what you
could say
we think it's a good idea you missed
that together because you'll get a
better result
but we don't think it should be a fixed
part of the approval
there are other things that are no
that's a condition you know that
that that that back porch needs to
because it's out of whack and it's not
just that the other and it's got a
that's in condition so as we see more
cases we're probably going to have to
get slightly more
sophisticated about how we review cases
and what we say and what we don't say
but my problem is still the sequencing
once it got to us
a we're told they've already approved
the pool they've already approved the
walls
and so you've got to just say whether
this landscaping and yet and maybe this
was before our current code
i remember not that many years ago
someone i think who was on gould
wanted to do a stone wall and a fence
above that and we said
total height is what controls here you
can't go above that
well the people on gold don't have the
resources that people on columbia has
but
so they were stopped in their tracks but
these folks on columbia
got their 10 foot wall and and that's
exactly why
now policy wise the city i think has
moved to where
those plans should not be so separated
so you've got two parallel approval
processes moving forward
and and to be clear about uh visa
gets involved if it's a variance of some
kind
that's associated with them and many
times that is appearing
arb recommends to be that
and i believe three commission
recommends to visa
well they're the main okay
the more that those are parallel then
the less likely this thing's gone
something like the pool will say
well i thought that was on i thought
that was on yours and you'll be dealing
with this
as at the same time in parallel
hopefully that will help
and it's still the aspect of code
enforcement somewhere along the line
when the plane was submitted and
somebody saw that raised pool and
nobody objected and then maybe the owner
just decided to put it in and said
find me or do you know make me do
something and
could code enforcement have said take it
out yeah i can't speak the code of
course
good good yes ma'am madam president so i
can speak to that oh sorry
our chairperson yes um not to interrupt
the discussion but from listening on my
phone earlier and i apologize when i
spoke i didn't use the microphone
um but it's very helpful if people are
listening to have the microphone close
to you
because it does get
hard to hear okay yep um
so just to answer the question and i
understand there's a lot of frustration
from this board and others
and neighbors about the project and as
was stated earlier today there are
like 20 different factors to how we
entered where right now but
from a process perspective the applicant
came back with a with an altered plan
any one of the boards and commissions to
my point about the arborvitae today
could have said
no it needs to be x y or z which they
did
and so there was a there were amendments
to that plan
once that modified plan got approved
uh through airbnb's app that now is the
definitive plan
that code enforcement will adjudicate
against for final occupancy
and for compliance bill they built
not to plan that is a known fact which
triggered them coming back to the boards
and commissions to say
do you approve of these changes that's
not the right way to do it but do you
approve of these changes
and you any of those boards or
commissions were instructed as were you
tonight
you are you do not have to feel
pressured to
a proven as built now we got into this
height issue you know that's a
much more complicated change than
arborvitae to
you know whatever else and in that
instance
and i don't know how much we're supposed
to go to the merits in this and that is
since they're still within
code i mean they were there the height
was within the code they were not
outside of code
so it became an architectural question
not a code variance question
but nonetheless the point is if you
feel and you're in a situation like this
you should not feel pressure
to approve something has built if
they've built it differently than plans
and they're asking for a change to plan
but an applicant especially with some of
the factors involved here should have
the right to come back and ask for a
change to plan
they have the right to do that you don't
have to grant it but they have the right
to ask for it
but still then we were told we can't
deal with the
i mean that the pool is not our purview
but just like the
parking lot for saint charles wasn't
anything we could
but we could get you on the air b if you
want to be on the air b
okay now there's an offer you can refuse
well thank you mayor so i'm i'm still
you know
in the world that we can control
you know i'm concerned that people don't
have enough
information or that they can't see the
plans
or that the parliamentary procedure is
not clear
so i want to make sure that we've taken
you know the steps we can
to have those tools current um
available and comfortable and if we feel
we need any refreshers on any of those
i'm i'm all for it so
so let me know let's move on to
expansion of fairy house into a very
fairy village at the south community
garden
that'll be a great note to end on
because mr sharp has already spoken
so as you all know
celeste and a friend worked hard
worked very hard to take a ferry house a
trunk a maple trunk can turn into fairy
house and take it down the south
community garden it's been incredibly
well received
but in talking with larry about it he
said and he maybe didn't
remember this that it'd be great if it
was interactive and there were little
roads and there were more
things down there than one you know
major focus it's sort of like
you know one tree in your yard instead
of looking around and so
very southern scary yeah no fairy fail
very little yeah or
of course
so yeah yeah
yeah so celeste and i have have talked
and celeste has approached the person
with whom she worked to be
like the creator of the the next stump
and um you know this is a conversations
lesson i've had
but we don't own the south community
garden and it hasn't been a vision of
the
tree commission to expand tree stumps
across
the breadth of the south community
gardens so
we wanted to share that with you to see
if you feel that's a great idea
it's going to look really ditzy it's
going to take too much maintenance
because if there's some interest in it
celeste maybe with the city of bexley's
backing could submit a grant to the
community foundation a lot of intent
for help so i i just you know celeste
feelings aren't going to be hurt
if you know everybody says one is enough
or
they aren't going to be magnified if
they say you know we want five of these
we just like feedback do we have
complete architectural control
i i don't but i you know i can hardly
use a saw
let alone a router so more serious
question
i mean in terms of maintenance are we
expecting the maintenance department to
do this
who i sense is stretched as it is
or are volunteers going to make sure
that
it stays very like
within within the grant application is
going to be a line item for maintenance
for a year
celeste has worked outside of actually
not not
andy's group yeah the person that
creates it would maintain it
a certain number of times a month
i think it's an amazing idea have we
heard from the south community garden
people
well we want to bring it here first and
then we can ask maggie
i you know that
i mean what are the downsides
in that particular location is next
between the government
right next to the playground right and
there's kind of a logical thing there
um i mean adding events
or so somebody wants to work in their
garden and the kids play playground or
playing
fair stuff i mean so that's that that
has some logic to it do you
so i don't know how many more of those
there are uh or whether
even whether the community gardens
people could also be tasked a little bit
with keeping that
shaped up i don't know i mean we're
you know it's not an isolated spot it's
a very logical spot to put that
right well celeste and i did talk about
asking other people to do it
but at the end of the day you know
they're picking their tomatoes they're
watering
they're running late you know i'll do it
tomorrow yeah
so i'd like to ask the head of the
bexley village
fairy village here what he thinks about
additional structures
for the for the fairy garden do you do
you
think um that would be a good addition
to the city or again
you know the last thing you want to do
is
you know add add things that you know
have um mixed appeal
i hate fairies i hate kids and i think
no i think uh as long as the addition
of the fairy palace goes to the east
it'll make it easier for me to water any
water features while i'm watering my
artichokes
so that would be my only advice yeah
yeah yeah i've been eating a lot of
artichokes recently
lucky you lucky yeah
so so we you know we're not looking for
an endorsement but if there are
if there are negatives we want to hear
them um
and if the mayor's okay to file this
letter of intent
richard thanks um my concern is
the initial fairy stump that you created
um hasn't been there a full year yet
and so we don't know what occurs
during the winter or are they going to
be covered or something
or they're not going to be monitored as
frequently either they're going to be
damaged or vandalized or something like
that and so
so so i'd be concerned about putting a
number of them out there
not knowing exactly what would happen
to have them potentially be destroyed
the maintenance program was was every
month for a year
so yeah okay one thing they do at
schiller park is they
i believe they have somebody adopt the
fairy garden for the year right
right sort of like a year it's a
year-long commitment
and then move over to i don't know if
they move on to someone else or i'm not
sure how they do that but
in answer to your question my at my at
this point
when the fairy garden's been there for
two months maybe
two months uh we haven't we've had some
things broken
and um and they've been fixed
uh and i always expected it to be like
the velveteen rabbit
you wear it out you love it you have
your good memories and
it's developed it helped you develop and
with your
friends and and offered enchantment and
we do have another piece
i'm gonna go off topic a little bit here
but i do hope to have
another element added to this that is
um literary um
associated so with a bexley library
because we did
have a submission to from a teenager a
story about the fairy garden
and we'd like to take that then to the
next level so i see it
building from these little children who
also are in this neighborhood who
are let out in the door in the in the
morning
who um don't then go back until they
feel like it and they're there
i've been there with them and they are
very much enchanted by it
and it inspires me because i think it's
in the right
i think it's in the right area and it's
and it's
where uh a lot of apartments are so
there are a lot of kids that can come
out and play and
and my purpose is not to have um
a fragile area and
um so and
i was just telling susan that we had we
we have owls stuffed owls from mr owls
house which is really clever because
you can put the owls flying in and out
of the branches and whatever
through the front door and both of them
were there
when i came back from out of town i was
so touched
because they were gone a week ago so it
just shows you some
yeah they can't they came back and see
it's not just the swallows that returned
yeah well i will take that as an
endorsement
if if it if it meets with the mayor's
approval
follow this letter of intent
forcing her to speak to this but i just
said to larry i think the backseat
library would be a great place
in the patio area and you could do kids
reading
outdoors you can do all kinds of things
but i mean that'd be a perfect spot for
for doing something and there's there
you know they're saying there's no one
or i don't know if you do a reading
garden in the space in between you know
well we've talked about that yes yes
there's the parks
right reasons to do so well ken and i
were down pretty much um
on the sunday of the garden tour and the
father and his daughter were there
and he's he said are you responsible for
this i said no we just put in mulch
and he said this has changed my
daughter's life we come over here
every day to play in the playground and
go to the fairy garden so
of course i thought that was wonderful
yeah so sweet i should have asked for
his name in an autograph or something
bringing it back
celeste i just what that is such a cool
project
and just thank you for doing that and
i'm watching it getting used all the
time and so it's just been really
special to see that
it is it's really amazing how it
happened because it started off with the
donation of six
little dwarf alberta
a spruce of trips to the um pool yard to
find the right
logs and trunk and and uh grant
kept the best one for me i was so
pleased so i appreciate
what your what your group has done to
help me and
drag it over to our house and garage and
i was over
at the um so i'm already searching for
new ones i was over
by yard barbers and looking at how old
were those trees those
the leftovers there a long long time
okay because i'm already cracking i
don't i don't lust after anybody else's
tree that's really healthy
i have about like four trees that are
deconstructed in my backyard that i'm
slowly getting through so if you want to
feel free to peck around and take as
much as you want
i do have a conundrum though is that
there is a pool
in within the fairy garden with no wall
around it
thank you all for your diligence and
your patience
and your attention and the
responsibility you feel to the tree
commission
with that we're adjourned until july
thank you everybody for helping me
with 601 so
[Laughter]
molly
can you can you stay a minute the mayor
has
had some updates on charter stuff