let me turn this
watch
okay I heard that thank
you I'm
unmuted recording's in process so we
didn't get B app recorded last time oh
I'm supposed to also do it on voice memo
I don't know how to do a voice
memo what oh I love mine so do Pete's
better at it than me
you record on your phone I've never done
it
before record what they don't want the
building but they don't care what it
looks
like how do you record a voice like
record use where where is that
I never do it don't you have an apple
voice yeah but I don't know where yours
lives I don't even know what it looks
like is that it I just do that
okay
yep we'll call to order the uh special
meeting for Bexley Architectural Review
Board on January 31st of
2024 and can we call the
order here Mr hder here M here Mr Scott
here Madam CH here uh we are going to
not do approval of meeting minutes
because not everyone got a chance to
read through them so we will save that
for the next meeting if that's
okay um and I this is a time for public
comment so if there's anyone in the
audience that would like to speak about
something that is not on the agenda and
we only have one application on the
agenda which is 2200 e Main Street so is
there anyone in the audience that wants
to speak about anything else please
raise your
hand okay seeing no one we will get uh
right into the application number B
23-23 the address is 2200 East Main
Street the applicant is Ryan Pearson the
owner is Continental real estate
companies and the applicant is seeking
design review and a recommendation to
the board of zoning of planning for a
certificate of appropriateness for the
Redevelopment of the vacant Trinity
Lutheran apartment structures at 2160
2188 and 2186 East May
Street this application was approved uh
with conditions at the December 18th
Board of zoning and planning special
meeting a condition of approval was to
was the return of the applicant to the
ARB to review changes uh that address
the ARB conditions for the building
design so Caren will give us a little
bit more of an update okay um what I'm
going to do is bring up the record of
action that was um a result of the
conditional approval at the Bap meeting
that we had in December um and
specifically I mean it's I'm not going
to go through unless somebody really
wants me to it's been online and it's
been posted to this um application as
well and I sent it to the board members
um I'm going to go down to the ARB
conditions um I want to go over them
read them through out loud so we all
know what we're talking about today um
there is one change and I'll explain
that at the end um these were the eight
conditions that the applicant left this
meeting with for with a positive
recommendation to bap bap did um accept
these conditions and remanded it back
here uh one was that the applicant
returns to the architecture review board
with material boards and samples two the
headlight screening be added to the
parking lots where needed three the West
Drive on the site be redesigned to
enhance the green space and allow sub
substantial tree planting four the north
and west elevations of the proposed
building be reworked to lessen the
massing create better connection to the
ground screen the garage and use more
consistent
materials five the height on the west
and North elevations toward the rear of
the site be
reduced six the west elevation have more
variation in the plane of the facade and
height seven the ARB supports the
addition of a six-story architecturally
to allow flexibility and less the
overall massing of the height of the
building height and eight outdoor dining
adjustments will be reviewed by the ARB
when a tenant is secured um what what
the what the board of um zoning and
planning did not do is accept this
approval or uh here the final remand
back here as a final approval um for for
I think very good reasons um and I just
want to make sure this board understands
that so this is not a remand back for
for final approval this is a brand back
for approval of those conditions if
they're met it's a recommendation back
to Bap for final approval that's because
it's a complicated project and there's a
lot of overlying issues like parking Etc
other things that are under the purview
of Bap we're just here to talk about
design tonight if things do come up I
want that are that are zoning issues I
just want everybody to keep in mind that
Kathy and I at staff or take meticulous
notes as we always do and they will be
talked about in beap we so so that's one
reason because there are too many issues
for it to just that the design might
affect so it needs to go back to beap
secondly because it's a big and
important project um we wanted all the
uh approval to be wrapped up into one
approval so it will be under Bap with
only recommendations coming from us I
don't mean to say only because they're
super important and Bap does take them
very seriously did I cover it okay Kathy
did I explain that the right way does
anybody have any questions about
that so that means in theory we're
looking for a recommendation to beap if
there are still outstanding items it can
always be asked for re remand back for
any design items um you know there this
a project has been approved with
conditions so we want to get it right so
we're here to talk about those issues um
I really didn't do a staff report this
time because everybody's familiar with
the building everybody's looked at it
and I thought best thing would be to
have the Apple kid come up to address
these these um eight
issues oh my
b not even your
job thanks
for I would have gotten a text
eventually
like oh I know sure I heard about it
awesome yes but definitely talk
close first off I I want to say what
we've missed you guys it's
been since we've been but U I want to
thank you for having us and special
meeting on the
project I'll a little bit of an update
but also just want to make sure everyone
understands um we we recognize and I
guess I want to make sure communicating
that we're not here for all the
conditions uh I think what we're trying
to do is address six of the eight um
first being they are condition one we do
not have material to
sharei condition
eight relative to t space so really our
our intent is to focus on conditions 2
through seven um the big reason being is
that this is where we are at this stage
is trying to advance Construction
documents and really start moving
forward with part of the project and to
be able to communicate properly and From
ph7 perspective what those conditions
are and what this looks like I think
that's the goal tonight is to show what
we've progressed through and U you know
really hearing everything from E and
we're doing that we me those conditions
I don't think it's where you in ohry
yeah
Sor
Jason estate 150 easto
Street um let me just insert right now I
don't think it's necessary but I just
want to put on the record that the
special meeting request was was from
staff not the applicant just so
everybody is aware we we are not you
know doing this for the applicants
benefit we're doing it for staff's
benefit and for the neighboring
properties community members that want
to have we wanted to make sure that if
we ended up with it turns out that we
don't but if we ended up with 10 more
cases on next week's agenda we didn't
want to be in a time crunch so I just
wanted to put that out there to make
sure that you know that it's known that
we we as staff wanted to do the special
meeting so I'll let p7 go through the
majority the comments in
detail because much better communicating
that information that I am uh I also
should point out you know Ryan Pearson
is serving as the applicant
unfortunately a couple weeks ago the is
ACL and a home recovering from surgery
so site related issues I would need to
be the one that addresses that I which I
can but that is relating to the West
Drive and how that landscape plays out
I'll let ph7 handle that part of the
presentation I should be but UL I just
want to thank you guys today for having
us in I think you'll be pleased with the
efforts that's been made um in our
opinion we've addressed all the comments
we've St back the north facade we soften
relative to the neighbors the West
facade uh is effectively a mirror of
East faade so it will be appearance the
same so hopefully that's satisfactory
and it's in um we've added the screening
related to the headlights and then we've
also
increased uh the or increased and
actually reflect a little bit better
some of the screen relative to the
Landscaping on the W side so I think you
know in at the end of the day uh We've
really accomplished what you have asked
for uh I do want to stress that you know
I've heard that there's some concerns
just relative to um how how we're doing
with the UN count um we are in a stage
where to be able to to make this project
actually work financially we need to
have the count 232 and that I think
we'll come into the conversation with p7
on how to address those concerns with
you guys and softening the going uh and
utilizing that sixth floor uh I think
was what obviously is the original inent
for you all
so
[Music]
and
interesting will you text Ben it's all
it's may hear anyone or they can't hear
anyone I'm gonna give the applicant two
microphon see well it might be a an
issue with the
equipment I don't I think
yeah yeah let's go and s in and see if
they can hear that
okay it's coming through
YouTube I hear it on YouTube so then
it's fine it's
delayed oh okay very different
issue oh I'm all messed up now hold on I
think so I was just listening you can
hear
us we had I was freaking out
again well welcome back yes thank you
for having us um my comments going be
very short sweet I think uh we certainly
just wanted to read through couple that
are on here um and I think the first
major comment that we wanted to sort of
address out of the gate was I know one
of the concerns that this board had was
how these app react to the sixth floor
and I think that was one of the one of
the things that we have talked about a
lot so um I don't think we need to go
into a whole lot of detail but yes
obviously they have they have granted
that variance conditionally as part of
that package so I think the D that we
had made over the last several months um
I think are certainly continuing to put
this building in the right picture and
um the last changes that we have made we
can focus in on a little bit here
tonight and um certainly answer
questions about the specifics of any of
but um if we we just want to go through
the high level items on those um I think
the easiest couple to start with um it's
clearly the West facade as it relates to
the east facade we understood the
concerns and the com about materiality
and how maybe the brick masses sort of
rest on ground and take to grade and a
little more traditional in their
execution I think you'll see in the
elevations if you if you want to proceed
to a couple of them there I think the
elevation probably good enough to start
with um you want that one sure this is a
good one this is the north um that's the
north facade as um has seen from the Vex
Square parking lot corner but in this in
this rendering here you'll see the the
north brick work that we have uh have
modified um we have we're taking that
material down to the ground and we have
instituted a step in the facade here so
that the top floor of the brick you see
with the corners the heavy cortis line
that's a falcony through the units above
um what what we were able to do on this
nor facade was adjust the unit mix on
the fifth floor where you see gray top
and this
this this this top row of of units has
been modified studio apartment rather
than trying to do more bedrooms and that
allowed us to recess that fif flb that
that was one of the things we had done
in addition to previously eroding the
corners by removing one two three units
um here more more four on each side but
um the the heavier the heavier Corner L
you see the Bri working its way down on
the north we thought those were
susceptable iterations of what we heard
from you guys as far as be more truthful
to material and support the
material recogniz that if you go forward
a couple
images this is looking now at the the
opposite corner of the the north side um
and the other major Chang that we have
made is we basically re res Shuffle the
deck as far as what goes on this this
this faade here and we Mir Mir the bre
faade mirr the bassing of it we were
able to introduce a little bit more
stepping in in the rhythm of the
building based on the type of unit mix
that's going on and within these
particular masses there's a the
one um yeah it's actually probably an
elevational issue well this is fine I
can show here um inside of our build
massing where this element exists on
both sides of the building this is our
elevator core we we've done a better job
of trying to identify how that um how
the trash an elevator and entry and all
that comes together so near this element
that has um a small you small camping
sign recogition um and what happens on
the opposite side we think that that
successful iteration of trying to really
tie building circulation point of entry
and still work within this this Loop of
mass the other piece you can see in this
elev or this picture here um one of the
comments was screen wall for parking so
we've been just a barrier wall for um in
glue of railings for all headlight
screening in the garage and then the
material around those openings we've
tried to increase sort of some of the
brick work on corners and so forth so
there's just more material going down
the ground on on this fac to help help
with that head
screen the other two items I think that
we
had talk about variation in plane to the
to the westad
and
not no I think that's so I I didn't want
to go too deep I want to just to walk
through the high level things and
specifically as it relates to those six
conditional it
you Our intention I guess would be
getting confirmation of those six and I
guess the process works right sort of if
they start to fall off the conditional
list we fully recognize that we need to
come back and present the material fors
and samples but we need to get deeper
into our design of wall sections and so
for be to present that to you um we have
ideas on all of it but we certainly
aren't prepared to do that that would
sometime in the future so um
[Music]
okay thank
you how many people in the audience
would like to speak tonight let me get a
feel okay please come forward and I have
a tablet there if you want to write your
name on the tablet
that
three
[Music]
minutes
yes just a reminder please don't repeat
things from other meetings and keep it
short thank
you um can you go the slide that shows
the nor side
please
oops um this the first slide that you
show see in where it shows the side walk
that would be a cut through so
want yes
okay so I love at 2240 brighten Road and
one of the concerns of residents on Park
to brighten is the current driveway that
accesses the parking lot um it has been
told to us that this is going to be
stayed as a pedestrian in walkway um it
is not live alley um seen any drawings
that come towards spray to show the
material show there
to vehicle traffic um so where's that
design
slide so there are ballards in the no no
no that is at the cor you're talking
about Alpha Brien yes because that one
of our biggest concerns of westly is
that additional traffic that not to be
an entrance or exit that agreed upon ago
but there's been no drawings there's no
talk about material what that is going
to look like um so that is one of my
concerns I would like to see
addressed um and then have few other
questions that um I would like to have
addressed by the applicant or by the
board um one of the questions
is
design how will the site be accessed
during the demolition as well as the
construction there not been any
discussion about that is that going to
be all from Main Street from Park View
um right in the mix the
city okay but we as resents need part
that conversation so who do we need
reach up to about that you say the
depart I need someone else he is not to
the resid so it would be
cath okay um next question
is
be parked employees that are working on
the project are they contain on stre are
they going be
bucket these are important questions to
the neighborhood and there's been too
many projects in Vexy that have been
approved and then after with that they
try to figure out how to resolve
problems we're trying to be proactive
and get answers now so we're all in the
same page so we're working together and
not separate that's great honestly I'm
writing them down and we will we will
all that another question is um what are
the hours of the construction going to
be is it considered um a COR project
because the business district or it's a
residential our construction are 7 a. 6m
Monday Friday okay and that doesn't
matter if it's a residential project
or okay thank you another question is
what's the planned traffic pattern going
to be during the project obviously
there's going to be some Road closers
with the vehicles the demolition what's
the plan what roads are going to be
closed are they going closed the entire
time or going be temporary closure from
7 to 6 that's going to affect traffic on
Brien Park View Drexel as far as one way
is it temporary we wouldn't have any
information on that at this time it
really is a matter of the project and
most's necessary typically you look at
the most
direct exit from the city when there's
demolitions involved out materials that
not having through the entire
okay so again is that something the
mayor is that through your department
who's that through
that these meetings and usually this is
discussed I've heard that being
discussed these meetings as far as
demolition plans as well as um
construction access if you would like to
share your concerns of
specifics I'm happy to okay and then
another question is this resurfacing so
there's going to be additional traffic
on Park View riding IIA plans to resur
those streets after the project is
complete that's always a city concern
for streets there is GNA be so much more
traffic and abuse on that I've stated
numerous times rden is not taking the
burden of this project for the city
there has to be open communication and
right now there hasn't been the mayor is
not listening the city council is not
listening and the boards there's a lot
of concerns project understand we are we
are listening we are listening okay and
I I would ask you to address your your
information I'm talking to miss Kathy
because she's telling me about the city
so I'm writing down notes as far as and
we are all writing down your notes and
we will try to address your questions as
we can but we don't have every answer
today so the more questions you have
that's great we will get you answers but
we don't have them today okay and that's
fine those are all my questions and so
again I just need to find out from Kathy
you know who do we need to reach out to
because there's several meetings there's
residents there's a group of us that
want to meet and we want to make sure
that our concerns were heard and
addressed and not just checked out well
we're starting today we're taking your
list so thank
you okay is there anyone else in the
audience that would like to speak about
this project please come
forward okay seeing none um I we'll go
to uh board members then next is there a
board member that would like to go
first I can go first um my first
question is about
the screening in the parking garage
since we don't have full-blown drawings
yet or I see a lot of bushes you
mentioned something more
perent microphone closer sure
so I just wanted to get a better
understanding besides the shrubs which
of course are
temporary you can show us the L
elevation I think that's deeper
lower
stra this is place to start um so along
the along along the second floor here
this floor assembly that you see
includes both the thickness of the
parking slab itself and then a 42 in5
wall vehicle barrier at one time we
showed this as cable railing and so we
had a very thin line that represents the
th
of above it was vehicle wall so that hit
out curves here we have parking here
where we have parking this is this is an
opening for Drive
traffic this is also a this this
entirety is actually a vehicle open
apartment you work down um same thing
happens for vehicle wall here as well
and then what about right below that
that's another level parking correct
open it's below ground okay yeah yeah
there yes there's the Topography of the
ground changes as you work from the back
front there's there's there's a little
bit in here where there's some opening
but um it also
and but there's
no similar wall in
that before it um before the the
changes that section quite good so the
what's going on there the crosssection
through
site best view for us to look
at
yeah um let go
deep scr
down one
of the which one one this is probably
the
best so you'll notice if you can zoom in
the parking structure on the first ler
level parking structure its headlights
um we're actually screened by um the way
that the phography works bankman as we
go further back it's this level here
where we we we introduced a 40 42 inch
high wall to help alleviate head screen
especially with cars that are marked 10
so and did 42 inches hit like a pickup
truck or or a larger vehicle does that
it's it's it's high enough for a
so I guess what I'm hearing is you think
that a similar wall is not necessarily
aall we don't believe it's necessary on
this war because in part there's there's
less openings for this to occur because
of the wayy works and also because the
way that this is sort of set into the
ground there's a natural burn here and
this is going to be able to be planted
with you denser Evergreen that will be
able to cover first floor we recognize
on the second floor it's that's it also
the headlight level just as as you see
it here has cross
so and then uh that was
the west elevation same on the North so
the north
elevation
um we do not have headlight we do not
have a second there's no level with this
so the basement level on the North
elevation is is below gra there so what
is the first floor of the building um
the headlight screening is at gr and
it's densely um landscaped and so we did
not
introdu are you putting some fence up on
that along
thect there couple things there's a the
screen fence on the North that would be
an elevation that would provide screen
but also because of the transition as
you go less will need to be some type of
barrier there to that from driving off
so between the vegetation the screening
fence and whatever barrier we put within
that garage there's probably triple lay
protection so what what help what blocks
the cars that are actually parking on
that lot do you have a fence and and you
know Hedges and stuff that so if
someone's parking and and their car is
facing into the Brien backyards you have
a fence or something that is blocking
all that right and how high is that I
want to say six but might be I think
it's do you know what material that is
at this point it's the same fence that's
uh at the back G down there so you know
that separates the the property line
between the G parking
lot and that that screen not only the
parking garage be paring lot that is on
that and so there's there's multiple
layers there work toward no problem
anything else Mr
no is there board
like swing around um let's let's
continue on that subject
um what is the material exterior facade
material for the crash wall are you
going to have it as a painted concrete
or a
brick right now we're imagining it as
pained concrete um we've studied brick
we can continue to do that
go
[Music]
down I think brick would be preferred
especially on the west facade um just
because it's of the neighbors looking on
that I think you can do it pretty easily
but
um I be preferred and I just have a
couple questions um before I get too
much into the back into the the actual
items
um well one while we're on the elevation
the uh your site section on the west
elevation page
[Music]
15 one more
whoops the west elevation go back one
more so the the actual grain that you're
cutting
through isn't representing of the drive
AIS in any
way right so that you're where you're
cutting through West on one and two
where it kind of drops down like a
fairly significantly along that line
This is a drive AIS correct so it's
going to be much grad as you go through
and where would that happen if if it
happens at
all what you're showing here in this
elevation I
thinks yeah so this is this just a
representational or is this an earlier
version or yeah I'm not sure that the
actual grade plan and
that completely lined up because I know
that I know the road not going to do
that but I want to make sure that you
know we understand that that planting
bed will follow the road R and we know
we have to get to this point here and we
believe at that point probably lines up
closer it's a more it's just not
represented in this
elevation I think that L lot's going to
be particularly very well screened by
the greatest yeah I'm I think the
screening you cover I think the crash
wall on the second floor is my biggest
concern one of the earlier meetings
because it's pointing right into the
windows um I think on the lower level
it's covered it's it's hitting a wall
the other car is in the other parking
lot where that actually addresses or
pointing your way so it's you know it's
kind of headlight to headlight north
side it's it's at the same grade as the
parking lot so it's no different than
the actual exterior parking lot so I
think the second floor of the parking
deck here facing west was my biggest
concern I think you've trusted it I'm
I'm concerned a little bit about the
material of that I definitely don't want
it raw concrete uh but if it's painted
or if it's even brick would be preferred
in this elevations but um definitely
dressed up and not being raw
concrete just real quick what are your
do you have a color of your windows on
the residential
portion sorry color color the windows
I'm assuming they're vinyl windows we
are looking to vinyl windows so you're
limited colors do you have an idea of
where you're leaning yet um well I know
we've talked about this in the first
mess the first meeting um we are still
working through to quite Frank we think
it's something that we'll have bring
back to you as part of the overall
material not white I hear not white in
your answer I'm not going to say right
need to it we're looking through what's
possible with the various systems um
we've been reaching out to the vendors
we've been working through um and it's
tied both to the price exercises and our
design so and I understand that very
well uh but I think white would be a a
hurdle you have to get under this you
would have some push back on on the
residential I get on the you're GNA have
easier time along the St fronts and
aluminum but you get into the vinyl it's
a little bit more of a challenge uh but
I don't believe white is the
answer do your
best can I ask where where that goes you
know in terms of moving forward with
this project I mean would for me that's
a pretty big one I don't I've I I've
worked on the I am not a fan in this
scale of a building this color sced and
having white vinyl do I think it's it's
cheap looking I don't think it fits the
character uh or the style that we're
looking for there are other options that
make them go away so you can get into a
tan uh or black uh there's some
longevity and durability issues with
black they've come a long way uh but
there are cost effects so with this many
windows it's a challenge uh but I think
it's something
that I would lean towards making it a
condition that we that we would continue
to review them right this isn't going to
be closed tonight that's one of my
questions as we get finished here is
we're making recommendations are still
open items how do we do
that but the windows here I you did this
rendering with all white windows on the
upper floors it would look very very
different I would consider the windows
part of the material package that's not
here yet and I think you guys definitely
have work to do than even beened that so
I just want to make sure tonight we talk
about that uh White is probably going to
be internal yeah so I mean I guess I
just need more clarification if there if
the material board is not here then we
cannot we cannot approve this even if we
had all the votes for it it's that's one
of the conditions I think the offer we
we've heard the nonwhite light windows
before the challenges is working with
our construction team to resolve that
and and find the medium a price point
that works for the project um so we know
why it's not acceptable what what I can
I guess challenged with at this point as
we can't fully commit to that yet
because we're still working through
vendors and and recognize that that is a
key point to the architecture I think
what ultimately what we're trying to
accomplish is the the bigger scope of
the project and understanding you know
we've been
through half a do these was talking
through the I'll call the the big
picture items and I think we're still
trying to focus on the big picture items
knowing material and specifically
Windows being one of them one of those
conversations that we'll have to have
down the road so that that's really what
we're looking for tonight um and and you
know it's not lost on this that
conversation we've had it jally a few
times and they can admit we've been
debating trying to find the right answer
I understand that windows can be harder
you than you think to uh to make
decisions on get pricing and and I would
I would further those comments just to
say we have to get to a deeper pricing
exercise on this entire building to know
how that one specific line affects
everything and we just aren't there in
part because we're not there and so we
would definitely put that on the list of
things that we would expect to be able
to come back to you show you samples
show you what our basis of design window
is not just what you see but what way is
you manufacture how butons work all the
detail of the window yes we expect to do
that and we would be happy to do that as
part of what's the break what's the
materi what's this that that to us is
part of exterior package of okay I think
formality we definitely need to dig into
how we get through
this uh just a couple other questions uh
before I get into an overall summary of
the changes
um so your G gas and power meters are
planned to be in the garage like you're
you're all your gas or if you have gas
I'm assuming you have gas for do the
retail um electric meters for sure gas
meters I don't know if we have that
stability with the gas company that
generally expect be see their meter from
that I understand be M but I think for
for especially for the residential
because of the number sheer number of
electric meters you'll have that would
be something that we want to see on BR
uh I think we've I I hear what you're
saying uh I got other props where we
have similar number of units but we have
a Master Meter of some sort that kind of
works that through I would not
anticipate a gas meter for residential
given architectural requirements um but
that being said you know in this
scenario I'm thinking maybe four or five
gas meters versus
232 have you have you located your where
your your Transformer might be for this
or multiple Transformers I'm guessing
there's one uh we're not that far with a
yeah but um you know I would anticipated
being C rooms on the east or west side
my my Des is going to be on the east
side
even real estate yeah because that will
drive some you know how close your your
your meters if there submeters for all
the units uh the issue is there's
hundreds of them so you break those down
in different portions of the building
based on your
those need to be in the ground I think
having those on the exterior facade
would a challenge
okay I think we covered this in multiple
meetings But Trash now is internal to
the garage correct okay uh and then I
had I think it's a graphic issue uh just
to bring up to make sure it's clear
clarified but on page five which is the
perspective of the west
elevation so on your two Center Piers of
brick Mings you have kind of the
pilaster for two floors is that North
elevation on the North elevation this is
this is it here see the in the center
Windows uh left and right now there's
peers running up is that a brick detail
in your facade or is that a rendering
anomaly I see other aspects of your your
design in the presentation that pick
that up and do other things but there it
seems to be just kind of a solo we've
been studying that as a detail um it
would relate to the brick coming down
just the the massing here felt like that
that here was a little so we were we
were kind of inating trying to L A
detailing there to help sort make two
story over two story which which is fine
I think there's I mean additional like
subtle details on that I just worry that
the pier is coming up and not holding
anything up or hitting anything is a
little strange yeah I think what's been
is some what's the the cap here what's
the and I don't think they need to R all
the way that's that's what we've been
studying and I think that actually this
P its own without them um we were
studying what there's a couple
opportunities on on side as well side
soing if it's aie of vocab find a way
to to I'm glad I brought up I thought
maybe it was a rendering anomaly
sometimes things get left over in a
rendering but if it's something that
you're working on uh I think it's
important that they get resolved uh and
not stay the way it is but okay thank
you so overall um you the eight items
there's clearly um we talked about
tonight that item number one um was not
going to be addressed tonight which as a
board we will have to have further
discussion I think you've addressed the
headlight screening uh successfully and
and um I don't see that is going to be
an issue at all
um number three I'm going to skip and
address number four five six and seven
which are all really kind of related
number seven is kind of the summary of
you know the effect of the six-story and
our recommendations to address some of
the other facades and the massing um and
you've gone back and and kind of
relooked at your your unit layouts uh
your unit Matrix and kind of um reduced
some of the units on that fifth floor on
the north and west sides pulling them
back um which I I appreciate because I
know that's not necessarily easy thing
to do in the construction of the
building um but then it creates these
little balconies on amenities for the
floors but they're not articulated as
these kind of you know you're not
pointing to them they're kind of subtle
amenities that they they can be up there
and habits you know hang out there but
it's not a a party deck per se so I
think the masing changes that you've
done from our comments in earlier
meetings is a successful move and I'm in
supportive of that because I think it
helps break down the building and its
scale and those facades and and makes
the overall massing of the facade have
interesting moments as it moves moves
along while also kind of maintaining
this more traditional uh modern feel
it's it's not purely traditional it's
not purely modern uh but it's also not
too fussy but but also having interest
so I think you guys have have done well
balancing all of the things that we've
asked um and and put together a design
that I think even though it's large fits
well into the main and the Aesthetics
that we looking for so thank you
appreciate that yeah I think that size
we think it's it's differences in the
Simplicity of the vocabulary being more
uniform across all four sides
positive well there's interest right you
look on the corner it's drops there's a
patio you look up so there's things
happening it's not a monolithic facade
in a fivestory residential they get
monolithic and you know sometimes
they're dressed up poorly and other
times they're plain so it's a balance
and I think you found that balance so
thank
you
M yeah I I would like to just go back to
my um question about the material boards
and the samples I mean for me at the
last meeting it was important and I
think I stated this that um you know I
would really like to see color
options um what I'm seeing here I as I'm
looking at it I keep looking at it of
course I've been involved with you know
design lines for for backley we all have
but what is it that makes this
building
be you know I I look at these drawings
and as much as I do appreciate all the
boots and dat that responses to the
massing it keeps gnawing at us because I
go to the arena district and this could
be in the arena district okay the color
scheme it could be in the new Dublin so
how do you
respond when somebody says this is a m
massive project for Bexley is it really
Bexley um and I would say right now it's
it's not that there's a number of things
have to be worked on but that's why the
material boards are so important to me
because I want to see those details I
want to see options for color there were
some public comments along the way where
they were bringing this out and if the
public is recognizing that this could be
in the new Dublin along you know the
river it could be uh in the arena
district it could be in Grand new yards
right and I get it there's a movement
for this to look and it's happening all
over the country it's not just you know
it's not just Columbus so how how do we
address that yeah I I understand what
you're saying as far as back I think
that we try to canas communities that we
do work in and we try to understand what
is me so um when it comes to the
selection of brick I mean I think the
type of colors that we have I think we
would take inspiration from things that
we think are important and and
historically contextually to the
location so if I go into another
jurisdiction and look at a project we
would try to craft out of materials that
is appropriate I can to the area that
it's in so as we looked at this we've
tried we have canvased what we what is
spe and you know you have you have such
an array of materials and extion is just
in the two blocks that are here so you
go from the opposite side of of Park
View and the Jonathan Barnes building
that is pretty contemporary and white
and glass all the way to the painted
painted CMU painted brick that is the
Market District and you keep going down
Main stre you get back to Red Brick with
you know lued fins on the one Dawson
Place build I mean you guys have an
Eclectic if you get off of Main Street
it's going to turn more residential and
it's going to have a together we look
across the street of what's going on at
Cal University and more institutional
buildings that maybe fit size and scale
and Trinity yeah and I think we we pull
from those the specifics as we look at a
gri I mean obviously we're trying to be
color conscious we think that there's a
shade of red a shade of gray that that
we understand that we're not being as
descriptive but I think that's part of
that detail of material not over mass of
and scale of building and generic
elevation I think what we're
representing here is where we think the
vision goes and I think we can get into
specifics about the brick um and maybe
start to relate to specific buildings in
the area or specific things I wouldn't
necessarily say that this isn't
specifically Bexley I I don't know what
that means any more than I think any of
you can tell me I I I think that you
guys just have an athlectic amount of
architecture which makes it a great
Community um we think this fits into
that system I that's how I would respond
um I could go into other places and say
this is why has to be this way you know
we have a project in worington that was
in downtown worington it had to fit into
a very specific vocabulary because of
where it was um I think with this type
of building and I think this looks very
different from most of the market rate
buildings that been built in central
Ohio Midwest I mean I just don't think
that we're trying to pick from one
particular thing I think that's been the
evolution of this project from where we
started to where we are now I think
that's what's made it more successful as
we've gone along so um I guess I would
maybe respectfully disagree a little but
without saying we know we have to come
back and talk about materialism I think
that's part of that
discussion yeah I mean to me as an
architect and you know living here for
25 years it it that's it's to me it's
just obvious is that the color scheme is
the trend it's not
about Bexley or or what our history has
been in terms of brick and brick
detailing things like that we're seeing
something that is a current Trend that's
that's the way myself and some others
see it and so I think we just need to
see options you know I mean there was
one public comment that really struck me
a couple times ago where you know if you
look at the brick buildings in Bexley
that are um that are recognizable by the
Bexley Community the commercial
buildings that are recognizable by that
aren't painted like this is um it's
clearly um the corner of Main drael
right the jepp restaurant and um Drexel
Theater building it's the new grammar
seat clearly there an iconic building
and Bri the library Stone so that
doesn't that's its own thing
um and then there's a couple buildings
right around the corner on Drexel um and
particularly Trinity over here you know
and their beautiful brick detail it's
not a red brick it's sort of a brownish
yeah red it has a nice tan mortar I'm
going into this
because as the rest of the board will
attest if they were asked when we have
projects of this
caliber new projects of this caliber
whether it's a demo and a new build
whether it's resident or
commercial it's important that we
scrutinize the
detail okay it's going to make a huge
impact on what this uh City looks like
so if this is all very important to me I
would like to see a scheme that uses
more of a buff brick for certain
elements with cast stone you know detail
uh or you know special kinds of brick
coursing you know stacking soldiers
stacking of um pieces having in set
panels you know that maybe the brick is
turned 45° to have a medall um that is
critical for what makes fley brick
architecture okay that it's not just a
facade of of of an ear that just runs up
and has the flashing and you know it's
just a running bond thing no that the
openings are special everything about
openings in ble whether it's brick or
not is there's some special detail to it
I'm not saying it has to be complicated
but I think we need call attention to
that we had the same uh discussion about
the the new commercial or mixed juice
building that's going on City we spent a
lot of time with them talking about you
know that brick detail so we're going to
scrutinize this with those materials and
that's why I asked if the conditions for
remanding to ARB included number one the
applicant returns to the ARB with
material boards and samples I'm not
comfortable you know giving an approval
to move forward without having
seen that condition does that make sense
or am I off yeah but I think they said
that from the beginning am I am I
correct Jason that you weren't expecting
an approval I guess to be clear we're
not expecting approval yeah I think what
we're looking for is um I guess more of
an acceptance if you will of the massing
and where we've come relative to the
north and west elevation I mean I think
that so this is a verbal
or maybe another way to say it is can we
can you amend your motion that you put
forth to visa to to
eliminate that we feel like we have I
just I don't know what the technical way
but to me it's just like it's a hearing
um we can check off whichever conditions
we feel have been met and they come back
with the other ones it's like a table
it's like a grou needs to be address I
don't I don't think it's a it's an all
or nothing which just means we have
another
hearing
know but the exciting part for me is I
feel like we've crossed the bridge based
on what I'm hearing here uh of where
we've been to now we're getting to weeds
the minutia which I think is great
progress and I'm excited for that
because that really helps us be able to
advance um that that's what I'm glad to
hear and realize that we're going to
have come out for some of the
details
of relative to being able us to be able
to work and get project to a point where
we can actually present something to you
and you're
comtable
end and and also just to be clear um for
example
the where is
it the tree planting three three thank
you three that that will really be just
as probably even more about the um tree
and public gardens commission than us so
we put that in there but this this and
actually to miss y to your question that
that that whole access and Landscape
still has to go through a rigorous
process with the tree and public gardens
commission all this is tonight is just
this board is the building
um and I and I you know just to clarify
it will need to come back so how much
time do I spend talking about this stuff
we know that it's GNA come back with
those
items a good
thing I mean I can pull up your
thing well that's a good segue because I
have a little
slideshow you know the
guidance sh is helpful start I don't
even know if it's really okay to do have
four five
ofs I understand yeah and I'm
really yeah so mine um but am
appreciative the move every step of the
way including the shet that we had here
uh the public could watch um there were
a number of moves in every session that
made this building better and better as
we moved our way along in terms of the
massing in terms of the stepping um in
terms of the you know the screening of
important things needed to be screened
uh the public area at the front that's
going to be you know a new public space
for the city of Bexley which is
wonderful um I'm sure there are other
issues that are you know going to come
up along the way as we get into the
reads of these details but I think in
general I'm in favor of where the
massing has gone to me it's just um my
big thing is with all these projects
that come before residential or
commercial is how does this fit into
beex obviously there are projects that
we'll see that are um they're they're
they're they're meant to contrast
Jonathan barnes's building is meant to
contrast okay it's a non-m Monumental or
anti Monumental modernist building okay
and we do have examples of buildings
like that scattered throughout Vex so it
does in a sense fit but it doesn't
resemble things that are going up
necessarily in Trendy neighborhoods like
you know Grand new yard or Arena
District or the new dou so what I want
to do is avoid um or at least you know
moderate the design so that people when
they go to the New Hudson 29 or they go
to the new retail spaces they look
around at this building and they say
yeah this is beex this isn't just
another you know mixed use building like
we see downtown wherever this is because
because that PL is a special place I
mean that was our modotto you know and
so we want to make sure that your
building is responding to that at every
level so do you mind putting that up
real quick it won't take me more than
two minutes to go through it do you
promise I
promise while you're doing that to the
build thing
questioner for Access off of that is
addressed as something that returns back
to the
commission to
address the offence and perhaps Mr O
could speak to what type of barrier they
kind of put there gate um because there
will be access the access through
you we do have planing for that area um
the key thing is that that also is a
secondary fire department access so
those will have to be coordinated with
uh col SP Department uh
removable what that form is at this
point is to to terment um but we have
talked to them and that was kind of a I
don't call condition but it was a
discussion point for them um ultimately
we do have I believe the treating
commission also wanted that
understanding materials that we have
down through there we do have plans for
that um I guess candidly that that's a
the detail of work through down the road
as you know we're still working through
the mass building and there's a lot to
go um I do
have majority of the answers questions
regarding that I mean all our
construction access is intended to be
off Main Street we will not go through
the Alexander Drive nor we go down the
Bri Drive will be fenced off and
barricaded so that there's no reason for
construction traffic to be going down
brighten um the detail as far as where
the contractor and the employees May
park that is yet to be determined but
also understanding the sensitivity of
the
neighborhood uh folks you know I'll say
this now it's not our intent to allow
any parking to occur in neighborhoods so
um you know again those are details that
we work through as we go pretty far down
the road but that that's kind of high L
you may not know this yet but I'm
guessing the heavy constructions first
so you build the parking garage first
right uh which becomes a great parking
spot for workers while you do correct
construction so you have a
spot maybe yeah I don't want to Bard by
Logistics but we have started talking
through that there's a lot of utility
work that needs to down on site first we
vertical with some of that
construction we int is to utilize the
the north parking lot for construction
trailers um side up Logistics and then
once the parking garage is up that's
where we parking so the storage of
materials and
everything and there there are lots of
preconstruction meetings with staff to
plan all this the I'm just based on
experience parking garage becomes a
great benefit to a site like this one so
tight that it's and for the recor the
city is just as concerned about the
condition of our streets making sure
that they're not damaged um and that we
also that the also kep
we'll be working some so I have a
question in in that drive is the goal to
make it so that only like bikes and
people walking can get down or are you
still going to allow like golf carts
down well I think it's been suggested
that there's a desire all C I think
there's some neighbors to the north that
want to access
training it will be wi enough to be able
to do that um but ideally
it's
and if you were putting bow up or
whatever they're
removable well they would be removable
general public I right a fire department
but the fire department you or I would
go out
there thank
you me too can I get back to my
yes should we put should we put the
timer
on minutes
so all right so I really wanted to do
this as an inspiration uh for the
designers um and we're not trying to
design this for you but I want to show
you the kind of things that we that I
feel are important to incorporate into
this project in some way so we could
just go through you know when you do
brick
detailing uh the the people who are
doing the brick detailing is critical
I've been by several projects um
um uh
in in different areas of of Columbus and
the masonry work varies greatly there
are there are masonry projects that are
terrible terrible detailing I don't know
who the contractor the the the
subcontractors are that are doing it
this project requires excellent Masons
to work on this it's backley okay it's
not going to be Lane Avenue um we don't
we don't want lots of uh you know uneven
clck ons or water joints so but this is
what makes beex it's clean this isn't
beex but this is what makes beex is
clean even mortar and brick okay um
there there's that's just really
important for the quality of our city
next things like this you're using
modular brick but you can do you know
medallions you can do uh uh transom
panels you can do
um you know all kinds of spandrel I you
know sort of make the look of a spandrel
um where you have Windows above and
below can you put them down can you put
a spal panel that has some kind of um
detail to it it doesn't have to be
recessed I know that's more expensive
but it could be something where you know
maybe they're pre-made uh by the Masons
and they can be put in and then we have
our local brick okay and there's
obviously Limestone involved with this
which you're not going to have I think
you have past Stone your cornice is that
right at the top of is is that a cast
stone piece at the top of your main
cornice at the fourth
floor I'm not sure that it is cast stone
but we're simulating cast right so it's
going to have that sort of buff brick or
buff Limestone look to or something but
so here they rely on the the the
Limestone the Indiana Limestone for
several details and I just think that
the locations of these um highlights um
is something that can be of inspiration
even if it's done in brick um even if
it's done in the same color brick it
doesn't have to be you know the same it
doesn't have to be you know a variety of
colors uh obviously the joints reflect
and and show off a lot of design but
this is Bexley you know and so I'm not
asking for a Flemish Bond or anything
like that I'm just asking for the
designers to put some uh human scale
details particularly into the first and
second floors um and then maybe at
cornis lines you know there can be some
some special details that will go a long
way to make this feel more best okay so
and then yeah I just I just pointed
these out because you know the the Gay
Street realy company um building at the
corner of Drexel in Maine has Limestone
detailing but it also has some brick
detailing and the first floor is is made
of a limestone which you're not going to
do but the idea of the scale of the
pieces and you can reflect that in Brick
which you're already starting to do I
can see it here I just don't want it to
feel completely industrial right like
something up in Dublin does I want it to
feel like Bexley which means having some
of these details I I think the human
scale pedestrian scale that you
mentioned I think that's I think that's
really key and I think that's inherent
in what we're trying to do especially
long
how kind of getting Scott talking about
what of my little
recognize those are
butal yeah sorry
sorry
scale we have to get from
a 20th scale Mass down to you know the
detail
stuff to get through your some of your
guys initial Concepts so we can get to a
deeper and deeper stuff okay that didn't
count for my
time
but you see what I'm doing with the
stand panels I mean these these ideas
for
inspiration uh you know these are more
our Deco I'm not saying it has to be our
Deco but I think that quality of um
detail at the human scale is important
and you just have to find select places
where you think this could happen
especially where they can be appreciated
by the residents of the building by the
residents Next Door by people visiting
uh you know this Plaza here Earth that
that they can be there and going to the
restaurant obviously we know the
interior will be totally up to the
restaurant but the outside is up to you
so let's make sure we get that right and
there's yeah so this is this is a
classic um Arena District building where
they do these details you can see it
just makes all the difference here you
have a rusticated base okay so you know
you're at the bottom of the building
it's heavy but it's all the same brick
it's just you recess every fourth and
fifth brick and then you come up to a
cornice line which you know you kind of
are doing already uh with the storefront
and then you go above that and even up
here and especially at the top you know
they're defining those Cornus lines with
those details and the the projections of
the forcing of brick and so on so I just
you know I don't know if there's one
more or two more or something the
lighting the lighting in those also a
dramatic impact on that detailing this
shows off exactly I mean here here's an
entry wave more our Deco but you know
they're using brick work and this does
this is all Granite you're not doing
that but this is all you know brick work
to accentuate that entry and then
there's I think there's one more yeah I
mean this is a little place in New York
where they fired special terracotta um
panels and and introduce that so you
know contemporary our Deco historic
whatever you know these details at a
human scale are critical is are the
custom fired terracotta panels a
condition but I'm just trying to you
guys might think of a really cool way to
do that that fits your budget but I just
think that has to be done um and I guess
lastly I'm still concerned about the
Hardy panels I mean Hardy panels you
have the guys out there cutting the
boardon bat and they all rely on C it's
all about the c i I've never seen a
Hardy job where they actually get two
pieces of hearty to actually miter or
but cleanly to each other is your Hardy
fatten
overlapping the panels that are there
and how do you make sure that you're not
relying on just C for the the lifespan
of this of this building so we're we're
actually looking at several different
type of ctitious panels great it may not
just be we are looking at several um I
can't tell you exactly which one yet
that's part of the discussion about this
is we price this out we figure out where
we want to go with the detail but there
are numerous types of centi panels now
that you might not even like theu I'm
not saying this is theu but the new.com
that's a Hardy panel that's that's got a
zero butt but it's not James Hardy right
what are some of the other brands well
there's there's a lot of different
panels This just
n they're
expensive Hardy is your your kind of
well it does uh or you do a you can do a
Hardy reveal system where the reveal is
more than the panels but you then don't
deal with that there's a metal joint in
all the joints I think bring yeah
exactly yeah I think we need to know how
do we achieve that look with that
material what is it what is that we
would expect to bring that to you again
get from a large scale to a minut scale
as
as because you have to understand you
wouldn't get that in the Hardy those
panels are too large understood that's a
Monumental scale that's going to have to
be I see I see commercial developments
going up all over where everything
relies on a talk joint in particular
when cast stone is used or pre-cast
concrete you know the details um even
the ones that are down at street level
that new building at Lane and uh um
north northwest or at Lane and norstar
whatever that that detailing at at the
ground is is is terrible I mean it's all
it's all just huge cockr and stone that
or cast stone that's not set properly we
don't want that here you know we want
this to be really clean and and Plum and
and the bricks you know to all be as
there's some great masons in this town
you can see it in the in the arena
district they're phenomenal brickling
the Columbia Gas building the chipot
building that is all fantastic brick um
especially in today's age I struggle
with with finding subc contactors that
can do with brick we've had to tear out
all kinds of stuff
uh we told to um could we go to the um
the southeast view of the the front near
the front there's one more I
think one
more I guess one
more there that one this one so again
details um I I really never paid
attention to these before but I don't
think these fit these little
whatever they are metal canopies they
just look like they're stuck onto the
building and I think in reality they're
going to look even more stuck on and not
part of the the beauty of this facade is
it just because you want to get you want
to make a bigger overhang for rain for
you know for water for people who might
go out on those little
bonies or is it just is it just going to
be a material thing and maybe the design
of little brackets or something that's
yeah we felt like there was an
opportunity to bring some of skin that's
in the back as it comes up and bends out
we just think that that we're wanting to
Accent those balconies a little more
than just a simple sure and I and that
makes sense but I just think that a
rectangle that's stuck out of the
building is not good enough there needs
to be some detail to support them maybe
at either end or something that you can
bring to the material exhibition and
then same thing with these railings um
these shouldn't I I think they should
have instead of just doing a horizontal
pattern maybe they have like a chip
Andale pattern or or a herring bone
pattern or something more contemporary
but something that's designed even if
it's something that you know is like a
standard option in the catalog from
wherever you're getting them there's got
to be something else besides the
standard horizontal look or the standard
vertical look can you can we do that can
we get to the next level for
Bexley I think the conversation would be
you know if you got a standard rail
aluminum railing around the building but
on
the Main Street side you you add add an
exore add add some detail as a as a
because you're not going to get a
manufacturer without a full custom
railing or doing it in a rod iron or
some sort of Steel um which I'm sure is
not going to be in your budget but I
think being creative at this elevation
would be beneficial ideas of how to
dress that up but then it's the same
basic railing that you have everywhere
else um which needs to be solid
but uh he dressed it up a little bit my
last comment has to do with um these
these balconies I just the more I look
at these and plan and in the renderings
I don't know how you even stand outside
with those how deep are those oh they
vary and some are walkouts and some are
AR shallow enough that they're really
more like juliets so I mean these these
in particular these items stand you can
walk out but this this one here I just
don't see how there's room to walk out
on that based on what I'm seeing in the
plan is but it's not also a railing
right against the GD that's right it's
not it's not a true J we're just
covering the window itself there's
enough space there that you couldn't put
a table no I don't think it's that's not
a 5 foot not you could even get a chair
it's it's show so plantings if you kind
of lean out and water
them I mean how do you how do you
economically justify if it's you know
it's this money to build this thing with
a railing but nobody can actually go out
on it how is that how does that work in
your in your calculations for all this
yeah we these are lar enough that you
can walk out on you can you can you put
a chair and occupy some of them you can
some okay so you're saying you can stand
out
there they have they have those at um
like some of the older buildings in the
short North yeah know what the intention
was there yes there's a a level of of
VAR in that some are much deeper than
others some are truly just there's a
couple that are just truly Juliet were
able to put in a full patio system
allows us to have right at the door so
it's just allow for more
natural and I like the variation that's
nice um so my my my uh things are
materials um the options that we would
like to see the color and making it more
vly with details and the color I think
those are critical for
in the next
round
um I do think the building has come a
long way uh from when we first started
sitting down and working at and talking
through everything I think the maning is
has gotten a really good place um I
think what you're hearing from everybody
um you know me uniquely Bexley is
something that is quality something that
sustainable and those two words don't go
with multi family housing very often if
at all um and I continuously compare
this development to some recent
developments in um Upper Arlington um
the one at kingsale and the one was
brought up earlier than one late um you
know unfortunately there's not a whole
food Clos here that's the one I go to so
I get stuck at that light sitting there
and looking at that brick and it is it
should not have been accepted the way
it's the way it's detailed it's very
unfortunate and um but it is what it is
that's not going to be exceptable here
um and I do think this is coming down to
we have a really nice approach to the
massing i' love pedestrian de along Main
Street um but now I'm looking at it I'm
looking into the details and I'm
starting to see okay well how are we
going to do that how we going to do that
how we going to do that and I appreciate
the presentation on bri because 100% yes
that's what's going to make this
building unique that's what's going to
make this building different um things
like these little brows I don't know why
I did those into this iteration either
uh coming out over the I'm not sure what
those are doing or not I'm not against
them I just don't know what the detail
is on they almost look like um shade
strings to me that's just sort of
attached to the building and so that has
a very to me that has kind of a more of
a
modern U conjecture to them than
something that maybe wants to be a
little bit more traditional support it
in a little bit more of a traditional
way of brackets or something I don't
know i' also Al concerned about the the
balconies and what are they going to
look like when you look up underneath
that's always a pet mind sort of walk
down like well that looks like a nice
Bing and you walk up underneath there
there nothing more than an untreated you
know wood de um and well that's
unfortunate that's just they just put it
in there to get on be honest the
railings I think you really do need to
take a look I I know the code
of um but I also know this is
um you've been talking that D family are
going to be here and and those sort of
things the beach doors are open to me
that's a latter effect you know I I
don't know if if that's a really true
issue or not but I think we need to
think through it and I also think that
it is a really nice opportunity to make
this uniquely nicely there's a um I
wasn't around when it was approved or
anything but there was obviously a a
push on the CVS building but the railers
that go around there think to match to
the library or something does so um so
there's there's there's been these
little little efforts that been made
over the years on Main Street I think
need to come in into this project now
and it's time U I do think materials are
incredibly important they some red brick
and probably a black Iron spot brick or
something like that but I think that
really needs to be explored um the way
you do the cornes and the way those are
all tied together this this I I keep
looking at this corner here where the
cson is I I always love The Pedestrian
feel to it but now I'm looking at well
you got this protrusion coming out and
it goes the black goes up a little
higher than the line of the the the the
balcony itself and I just look at that
like wow that that seems a little fussy
to me but I'm looking at a rendering and
yeah I'm looking at a rendering and I
get that we got to get in got to start
building this thing um a detailing
perspective so I respect that I get that
um but I guess and then I'm G to go back
to the SMI board um I heard you say 're
not using cast stone but cast stone
right that means phone with plaster on
it I I don't know if we have that kind
of jurisdiction or not but I'm not a fan
of eus at all again eus is not uniquely
deing that is I just I don't think there
should be any exist on this build but I
don't know if we what about extruded
metal street
ofal yeah that that would be fine you
know I'm I'm okay with you know metal
panels ACM panels and those sort of
things I don't think it really FS here I
like where you were going with the uh
the Smith board that they use on Cru
sadium that requires you know a little
bit of a different type of detailing and
the reason I like that I like like the
traditional nature of the brick below
and then the modern
contemporary language that that starts
to bring ability that starts to have
appeal to me um but you know I I really
do you know the one image of the brick
brought up and showed G days how they
sort of rusticated that with the brick
and I think they were either use a
different color or was recessed I think
those are the details that's going to
make this thing special and um and I
think that's our next challenge really
by TR I think mancing is wonderful I I
think that's really come a long way
because I like on the North elevation
that that little mo that that up a wall
really make a huge difference and I
think the moood to Bringing Down the the
Brick to the base and make sure that's
it's got It's got a base and it's
supported I think I agree that the um
the second level of parking in in that
that
brick just to to make it BL in and not
look like this there's nothing wor Park
Garage Bri columns going up and then
concrete kind of zigzagging back and
forth you
know it's it's those mov and the windows
are going to be a major I think issue
today so um I think that's
where U thank you very much uh okay so I
have a question on your uh picture the
north side of of the building your new
rendering of it you show that that was
now a recess and you're creating
balconies up there but I don't see them
in the floor plan are you creating real
balconies up there yeah
um sure what plan you have this package
you can see zoom in on the two Center
masses of the bra um those you can see
the returning back back on the
top back those actually are actually
quite deep I
think across the size you see those are
six or seven feet in
dep it's just the oneing and maybe I'm
not looking at the right I
think it says modified six days ago is
the package on I saw I saw them in the
floor plan because I was curious how you
were doing
it okay can you pull that up
I'm looking for
it it'll be the fifth because you're
seeing the floor
below there it is okay y so the one that
is that I'm sorry because the one I'm
looking at says it was modified six days
ago so I thought that it was um the most
current okay that that answers my
question um okay okay so my next
question then is about the space between
this building and the Alexander so in
the elevation that you draw the
section yeah if you would um go into
that drawing so it was my understanding
that the Alexander was 5 feet off the
lot line correct the that right there
that distance is five feet Yes a portion
of the not the entire
yeah so you call out a 10 foot a 22 foot
and a 10 foot and a 5 foot and that
totals 47 feet not
45 and you said a 45 foot separation so
is it really 47 um Edge group has
produced this I do not know the exact
distance I believe that it's I believe
these are correct so um I believe it's
47 okay so it really is that you are
saying that you will be 42 ft off the
lot line
okay again like you know these are the
only drawings that I can really evaluate
so um I'm just trying to understand them
not
buing okay the back of the building um
I'm also was looking at some of the
spacing back there and for the first
time I noticed that all of those 49
parking spots say that they're for comp
cars only has it always been that way
yes
yeah they're effectively the same type
of parking stalls they're out here in
the lot right behind them so those are
angle correct but those are actually
depend deep the 16 ft allows for the
arring the car into the spot so the true
depth is a little bit more but you know
the the spot itself is 16 ft well so
that one drawing says that some of them
are 14 1 ft some of them are 16
ft and so are you really saying that
because there's an overhang for your car
it's really 16 and 18 feet and what's
the
wi it's say
14 it should be 16 we to go we have a 26
foot the section that you were in the
section
and there are minimum requirements that
we have this into that back area
right middle drawing the back yeah right
there zoom into that so that calls
out okay again I must been to looking at
a different drawing because the mine
said 14 feet and 16 feet is a 22 foot
drive out so are you saying that they're
really 16 plus a couple feet for
overhang
correct I'm thinking that actually 26
because I work fire department I
guess I'll confirm okay because I think
that's going to be important to do that
just to make sure that we have all those
Dimensions down and that we know exactly
what we're getting um because are any of
the spots inside the parking garage
compact or they all uh
no 9 by 9 by8
yeah because that is a a standard
parking spot um
okay um okay so one other thing this I
still am struggling and I really I know
that parking is not our thing but I
really am hoping that be will look at
this because I don't really see that you
took any units off of this when you
added the sixth floor that you we're at
232 is the number unit
which
um I guess I probably cut it off a
little prely but um we do have to work
through a share parking agreement with
the that these app has to approved so um
I know that's something the attorne
involved but I that's okay I I my
concern with that is that we all for the
sixth floor and I'm all for the
reduction in the mass of the building
but I'm not sure that we got equal
because those 13 units that you added on
that sixth floor um four of them are two
bedrooms and four of them are three
bedrooms and to me that brings maybe 20
cars and so if the unit number is still
232 which is what it was before that I'm
I'm worried that
we're yeah and I I apologize Ryan's the
one who work for those numbers but I
want to say off the top my head based on
C code what the number of spots that
were required were 300 spots and we have
313 total for that and that was based on
the zoning text and the shared parking
agreement that we need to enter in okay
um So based on that combination I I
thought that
that Kath I'm probably I'm way out of my
l
I believe that's the way I recall it
both but I've got
a 33
total
toal that's the Delta is the 13 but then
in addition to that there's also a
shared Pro agreement that between cic
C and at that point you'll have
exact sizes of all the parking spaces
and all that okay yeah I just want to
make sure that VAB takes a good look at
that because in my mind it's still a
point of discussion
okay and the staff report should provide
that write down along with what's part
of the code and then the credits that
apply okay okay and then um my last
question is a question for you um so a
lot of what we talk about when we have
our workshops as a board is that we
struggle to get good follow through on
projects we have um almost one project a
year I'm going to say that doesn't quite
go like you know we thought it was going
to and as a board we try really hard to
try to figure out what could we have
done better and what we usually come
back to is a lot of the buildings that
we don't think get built quite like we
thought they were going to there's a
change of architect from the beginning
to the um to the
CDs and so do you intend to keep ph7
involved sure I sure
hope be the AR okay yeah that's
important to us because again we have a
lot of people that come in and do the
Pretty presentations to us and then they
get fired and somebody else does the
drawings and we struggle to you know to
find all the things that didn't happen
that we thought were going to happen to
have them through the
process said before int back here a
couple more times and it's our
expectation to work through that
so ideally the goal tonight was to
really get through the mass that's a big
part had been a big part for the entire
process right I that we can get that
portal then the details start that's
where so what do we think the next steps
are then you planning on coming back
back to the next ARB meeting no we won't
be back to the next ARB the big thing
for us now is to um really dive into the
documents and start coming details you
know we'll we'll play out some
conceptual plans when we get to a point
we're comfortable with that you know
behind the scenes we have our
construction estimated team working
through these drawings here pricing uh
trying to work through some of the
details uh to understand cost and such
um and we do that in parallel with the
architectural team and and working with
vendors uh I expect that to come through
the next few
weeks and then from there I think you
know with with an understanding of where
we are construction cost wise trying to
understand is inevitably it's going to
be over budget I just say that right now
um we're going to have to really work
through some of those details and then
when we're
comfortable uh the stage I think we want
to be overly communicative with this
group given where we are so the next
time we'll be through we'll have some of
those details um and try to you know
we'll be honest too uh I saw all that
drawing what you share was a lot of
white windows and they still look good
with the briad so that may be a
discussion there to to talk through um
you know obviously there's a lot of
vendor things have to work through uh
but at the end of the day we got we
need be a part of the process so are we
basically um taking a vote are we taking
a vote today then um because you you
don't want to go to be app until you
presented all the materials I I think
it's level of comfort where we are I
guess rad said best if there's a way to
the conditions uh in a way that the rest
the the elevations I'm not sure how that
is permissible I think we can do that
proced it seems like we could read into
the record some kind
of um
consensus that certain
conditions have been satisfied it's not
an official vote but I think from your
perspective it would be very difficult
for the board to sort of retract that if
we go on Rec record
that conditions
two four five 6
7 have
been sat have been
satisfied subject to the final drawings
uh I think number three maybe we I think
that drawn I think that really is under
the purview of the Dre and public
gardens
commission I I did take a St at if you
want to hear
have with with conditions well so but
just if you look at just the mathing of
the building if something would happen
to to change in the size of of a parking
of the parking lot on the North side and
the building had to get smaller by a
foot or two I mean does that does that
if we approve the massing if we say
we're all good with the massing and then
the building has to get smaller by a
foot or two or something is that I think
the zoning board could make that
decision but you know the overall design
of the building is what they're they're
leaning on you to provide Direction on
that but and and that's why I'm
suggesting it's not a formal vote I
agree right but if we give direction and
and the
board like I said goes on record that
generally those conditions have been
met absence some material change in the
design and plan
and that conditions one and eight remain
un
unaddressed and then it I think what
they're looking for is enough comfort
that they can move forward spending more
money on these plans to get them more
refined and that'll give them time to do
the material presentations and with a
project like this I will write up an an
Roa for a tabled application so you can
technically table it in your tabled
record of action will be that it was
tabled with these two items still
remaining to come
back but you don't want to make a
recommendation on
27 that I don't know what that does
because all the bees up is there
anything that you're going to beap for
before I know but it's only a partial so
I would wait before I I would have not
be comfortable saying is there any
reason that you feel that you're going
to need to go to beap before you come
back to here I don't I don't think so
either so I think it's better just to
table it and in our record of action for
the tabling we'll address that two
through seven
minus three which should go to tree and
public gardens commission has is
withdrawn three is with satisfied right
assuming conditioned on no material
changes to the plans presented and that
intent of the the board is to focus on
on item one in particular item eight is
going to be top item eight is going to
be down the
road that that may it withdrawn in our
recommendation we don't have a tenant
how we hold
yes over that that connector back Bap
has jurisdiction over everything okay I
think that's a big pie I didn't comment
on I didn't really think our
that's a whole another that's a whole
other um process where tree and public
garden commission will look at the
overall plan and make a recommendation
to Bap Kathy correct me if I'm wrong but
Bap has the final approval over
everything it needs to be designed way
correct on the plan right now this looks
like they're addressing the corner up
here and almost is like you could assume
they're not they're just going to leave
it as is right no okay that's be yeah
just to make sure papers go up there or
something or something I don't know why
fire
L
yeah
that's there has been in previous
meetings that I listen in there has been
discussion about that path and details I
don't know if it's still on their radar
and we can make
that reminder that should be on that
radar still fire access no but that that
whole area has been discussed and
there's Focus I just don't know if they
came to yeah so I want to assure you
that all these issues like parking and
that access and what the tree and public
gardens commission will give a
recommendation for has been discussed in
great detail at Bap and Jason does an
amazing job of giving a staff report on
that so um the only thing they're not
talking about is the building details
which is what we need to concentrate
on okay so are we just basically asking
for a table is that it's that simple
yeah with a with but but within the
minutes going on the record that I I
think there's consensus that the massing
scale the the conditions have been met
am I
misreading no I was clear in my
statements that those I felt like they
they had met the those specific
conditions item number one should be
expanded to include window color and
special details that's all materials
yeah all it is all
encompassing so that that publicly un
record that's my
statement the meeting minut the meeting
minutes should reflect that I think each
board member basically stated that so I
don't need I don't know that there needs
to be a redundant State no a blanket as
part of the table I think if they
request the table we just vote on the
table agree and I would
agree okay and you're asking for a table
corre okay is there a board member that
will make a motion to table stwo
moved
all
I will call M ster yes Mr Scott yes Mr H
yes Mr Paul yes M K
yes you are tabled um so you will just
be on a regular agenda at this point I
don't foresee huge long meetings so we
probably will not do special meetings
for you again
that's
don't issue for us with this this time
around so I appreciate the fact that you
accomodated that piece so see you
soon no no be app until they're done
with us not on the agenda next week no
that was the point let make that
clear so just for clarity for the
audience will this project will not be
on the agenda next week at our regular
ARB meeting and will not be heard at the
February 22nd bees
up until these details are worked up but
but you may be on the February ARB
meeting no no no that's only a week away
yeah that's next week next week March
the March yes so so you may be back in
March that's your call yeah so a lot of
times when we table we do table to a
specific date um so we will just say
that that's the earliest that you would
come back yeah that's fine okay and then
if you need to push it back further than
that you just let support yeah that
sounds great okay thank
you all right we are aduring thank you
very much the
14th